Long time Diablo series fan (got the original on release) and lurker, first time poster.
One of the most appealing and endearing aspects of the series over the years has been the massive replay value of the games. The terrain and loot randomization system is genius.
It was always tons of fun, IMO, to make and level up all sorts of different character builds (which was much more relevant in D2 than D1). Bowazons vs. javazons, hammerdins vs. zealots, frenzy barbs vs. concentrate barbs, etc. Each class had multiple different builds, each with a different flavor of play. How many on here didn't have multiple builds of at least one class? The desire to try out all of these builds and develop hybrids of your own really added some length to the game's replay life. There were literally thousands of unique distributions of skill and attribute points, which meant that each player character had a unique skill and attribute base set. That's no longer the case, as a result of a major screw up, IMO, on Blizzard's part.
In D3, changing your build merely requires clicking a few buttons. Blizzard purported this system to be and unprecedented level of customization of characters. In a way, that's true--it's unprecedented in the Diablo series for players to have absolutely no ability to customize how their characters are built. There's no ability difference between two characters of the same class and same level. Only the item sets differentiate them. This was a major lack of foresight on Blizzard's part, IMO, and frankly pisses me off, as it destroys one of the core aspects of the game.
And then there's the level 60 cap. Completely asinine for reasons that have been well fleshed out before, but I'll just give my personal take on it. I was a pretty serious D2 player. Not a super elite player by any means, but there were plenty of week and two-week stretches where I played it a LOT more than I've played D3 this week. I never sniffed level 99 in D2. I think I got two characters into the 80s, and 88 was my high, IIRC. I've got a level 52 monk right now. I'll probably be level 60 by the end of next week, at the latest. Getting to level 99 in D2 was a huge accomplishment. Getting to level 60 in D3 will be par for the course. Massively lame.
For shame, Blizzard. For shame.
**DISCLAIMER: I'm having a blast playing the game so far, so I'm no hater.**
I would be kinda pissed if it took forever to level to 60 in D3, atleast with the way the skill system is in the game. If I had to spend months on the same character just to get access to the last few skills than I would probably give up and start a new character.
You should have also mentioned that it was only hard in D2 to level up from about level 60/70ish to 99. You could get to level 60 in a day.
Str: The amount of Str needed for highest level gear
Dex: amount to wear highest gear
Vit: all other points
Energy: If you needed some more mana
Wow, gosh have I missed what Diablo is all about man that such a superior customization I don't even think Diablo 3 will have 1/2 the builds D2 did. I mean who needs level one spells right? Lets all just wait till level 30 to put all our points into those two awesome spells i want then have everything else at level 1 to get there. That was so superior in every way man.
/sarcasm
Honestly D2 had the shittiest customization ever. Hell it had less than diablo 1. At least in D1 I could use some random as skill. in D2 I had to use a set build or I couldn't beat the coolest parts of the game. If a game requires you to go onto a website look at a guide and then you'd beat the entire game then there's something wrong. Runes have varied the Diablo 3 skills system more than D2 had with skills plus items. Putting a bigger emphasis on items was key to. It's not like they said oh items are just cool looking upgrades that help you out a bit, now they actually do a lot more. their upgrades are a lot more significant to compensate for the lack of Attribute distribution.
To your point on level 60. Honestly It's fine. If you enjoy going from level 60-90 and getting nothing then that's your preference but honestly it just makes it bland and boring to me. It reduces the game to a grind instead of rewarding the player which, if i'm correct, is what video games are all about. The reward in this game is inferno. Hell is supposed to be a place ot farm while inferno is the challenging end-game content. It has monsters that start at level 61 and go to 64. The whole point is to not just sit on your ass and get nothing for being max level, It's so you can go into inferno and farm gear. This is why they made it easy. so everyone can hit 60 but not everyone will actually be able to play inferno through or even past act 1/2.
I understand you're not a hater but let's be perfectly honest with ourselves here. D2 had shit ass poor customization and they greatly improved upon it in Diablo 3. Cookie cutter builds isn't customization it's the opposite.
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Not even Death will save you from Diablo Bunny's Cuteness!
This was a major lack of foresight on Blizzard's part, IMO, and frankly pisses me off, as it destroys one of the core aspects of the game...
So, D2 had a lot of builds because you were forced to start over, but D3 doesn't because you can change. I'm sorry but this is the stupidest logic people have shown since Blizzard introduced this system. Can you play with all skills active all the time? No, so my logic would say no, your character aren't the same as mine. Unless you change your skills to those of every wizard that joins your game, but that's idiotic.
I don't know how you play, but I constantly refine my skills, testing and contemplating, and I've found many good combos, even some that don't really work for me. My one friend also plays a wizard and I cant think of a time when we were trying the same skills. In this game you're welcome to trade out your style to try something new, it's what makes the game great. According to what you're saying, you need to be shoehorned into a corner to make the game replayable and enjoyable?
Well, that's sad to hear. Not for Blizzard, or for me, sad for you. My wizard is almost level 60 and going strong in Hell, strongish. And I'm going to be making another wizard, sure as hell. I'll have the benefits of being able to craft good items, and to aply everything I've learned during my first playthrough. You can bet it will be fun and exciting. The constraints games use to employ to enforce 'replayability' or 'customization' is a bit archaic, and it's very refreshing to play a game that's thinking outside the box, to try something new. If you want to limit yourself through mentally constructed limitations (i.e. I can change my skills, so I can't replay), then that's all on you.
And then there's the level 60 cap. Completely asinine...
Do you know what I think is asinine? Placing an arbitrary, nigh unreachable number out there, just for the sake of keeping players playing. If there was content at level 99, sure, but there wasn't. I never had any 99s. Yeah, you can turn it around and say it's all one me, though the reason I had no 99s was because they had nothing to do, except for repeating old content a bit easier. You can't refer to that as an effective endgame. Inferno is a wall of constant improvement and challenge, while D2 had an open field for faffing about.
I prefer the new systems. It's all an improvement over the issues I had with D2. I supported the changes since they were announced, and I'm glad to say I'm sticking by them. Well, these are my thoughts, people do differ, so its unfortunate that some people out there are unhappy with the game, but oh well, that's life for you.
I have to say I've come to love the rune system. I'm a huge fan of inventing in characters and feel that loss majorly in D3. The fact is there are like 24 attacks per class and an insane amount of combinations, most of them good, only a few great, makes runes worth it. I've changed my skill set 3 or four times completely, an each time its brought a whole new feel to my Wizard. See the problem with D2's set up is it becomes more difficult to experiment with characters. Right now I'm thinking, mirror image with 5 replica rune , or fracture teleport? Which goes better with ray of frost? In D2 I would never be doing that because you can't set up skill trees with a million attacks since you need weak attacks to start off with. Yes you lose some replay value, but honestly did you need to level each char in a separate build? Was the leveling of each build that much fun?
Who the hell wants to roll another character just to try out a new build? This and the level 99 cap were artificial game extenders. Like the guy before said, you basically had one way to allocate your attribute points if you wanted to be successful in the late game. That is no customization to me.
D3 is a online only game so the multiplayer isgoing to be a huge part. Honestly most people will beat the game a few times and then only focus on being able to kick ass in arena by farming for new gar so the lvl 60 gap is perfect to allow new payers to play at a high lvl not needing a year to get to lvl 90 just to be able to play at the highest lvl of the game so 60 is perfect and im sure it will go up somewhat when the expansion comes out.
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One of the most appealing and endearing aspects of the series over the years has been the massive replay value of the games. The terrain and loot randomization system is genius.
It was always tons of fun, IMO, to make and level up all sorts of different character builds (which was much more relevant in D2 than D1). Bowazons vs. javazons, hammerdins vs. zealots, frenzy barbs vs. concentrate barbs, etc. Each class had multiple different builds, each with a different flavor of play. How many on here didn't have multiple builds of at least one class? The desire to try out all of these builds and develop hybrids of your own really added some length to the game's replay life. There were literally thousands of unique distributions of skill and attribute points, which meant that each player character had a unique skill and attribute base set. That's no longer the case, as a result of a major screw up, IMO, on Blizzard's part.
In D3, changing your build merely requires clicking a few buttons. Blizzard purported this system to be and unprecedented level of customization of characters. In a way, that's true--it's unprecedented in the Diablo series for players to have absolutely no ability to customize how their characters are built. There's no ability difference between two characters of the same class and same level. Only the item sets differentiate them. This was a major lack of foresight on Blizzard's part, IMO, and frankly pisses me off, as it destroys one of the core aspects of the game.
And then there's the level 60 cap. Completely asinine for reasons that have been well fleshed out before, but I'll just give my personal take on it. I was a pretty serious D2 player. Not a super elite player by any means, but there were plenty of week and two-week stretches where I played it a LOT more than I've played D3 this week. I never sniffed level 99 in D2. I think I got two characters into the 80s, and 88 was my high, IIRC. I've got a level 52 monk right now. I'll probably be level 60 by the end of next week, at the latest. Getting to level 99 in D2 was a huge accomplishment. Getting to level 60 in D3 will be par for the course. Massively lame.
For shame, Blizzard. For shame.
**DISCLAIMER: I'm having a blast playing the game so far, so I'm no hater.**
You should have also mentioned that it was only hard in D2 to level up from about level 60/70ish to 99. You could get to level 60 in a day.
Str: The amount of Str needed for highest level gear
Dex: amount to wear highest gear
Vit: all other points
Energy: If you needed some more mana
Wow, gosh have I missed what Diablo is all about man that such a superior customization I don't even think Diablo 3 will have 1/2 the builds D2 did. I mean who needs level one spells right? Lets all just wait till level 30 to put all our points into those two awesome spells i want then have everything else at level 1 to get there. That was so superior in every way man.
/sarcasm
Honestly D2 had the shittiest customization ever. Hell it had less than diablo 1. At least in D1 I could use some random as skill. in D2 I had to use a set build or I couldn't beat the coolest parts of the game. If a game requires you to go onto a website look at a guide and then you'd beat the entire game then there's something wrong. Runes have varied the Diablo 3 skills system more than D2 had with skills plus items. Putting a bigger emphasis on items was key to. It's not like they said oh items are just cool looking upgrades that help you out a bit, now they actually do a lot more. their upgrades are a lot more significant to compensate for the lack of Attribute distribution.
To your point on level 60. Honestly It's fine. If you enjoy going from level 60-90 and getting nothing then that's your preference but honestly it just makes it bland and boring to me. It reduces the game to a grind instead of rewarding the player which, if i'm correct, is what video games are all about. The reward in this game is inferno. Hell is supposed to be a place ot farm while inferno is the challenging end-game content. It has monsters that start at level 61 and go to 64. The whole point is to not just sit on your ass and get nothing for being max level, It's so you can go into inferno and farm gear. This is why they made it easy. so everyone can hit 60 but not everyone will actually be able to play inferno through or even past act 1/2.
I understand you're not a hater but let's be perfectly honest with ourselves here. D2 had shit ass poor customization and they greatly improved upon it in Diablo 3. Cookie cutter builds isn't customization it's the opposite.
I don't know how you play, but I constantly refine my skills, testing and contemplating, and I've found many good combos, even some that don't really work for me. My one friend also plays a wizard and I cant think of a time when we were trying the same skills. In this game you're welcome to trade out your style to try something new, it's what makes the game great. According to what you're saying, you need to be shoehorned into a corner to make the game replayable and enjoyable?
Well, that's sad to hear. Not for Blizzard, or for me, sad for you. My wizard is almost level 60 and going strong in Hell, strongish. And I'm going to be making another wizard, sure as hell. I'll have the benefits of being able to craft good items, and to aply everything I've learned during my first playthrough. You can bet it will be fun and exciting. The constraints games use to employ to enforce 'replayability' or 'customization' is a bit archaic, and it's very refreshing to play a game that's thinking outside the box, to try something new. If you want to limit yourself through mentally constructed limitations (i.e. I can change my skills, so I can't replay), then that's all on you.
Do you know what I think is asinine? Placing an arbitrary, nigh unreachable number out there, just for the sake of keeping players playing. If there was content at level 99, sure, but there wasn't. I never had any 99s. Yeah, you can turn it around and say it's all one me, though the reason I had no 99s was because they had nothing to do, except for repeating old content a bit easier. You can't refer to that as an effective endgame. Inferno is a wall of constant improvement and challenge, while D2 had an open field for faffing about.
I prefer the new systems. It's all an improvement over the issues I had with D2. I supported the changes since they were announced, and I'm glad to say I'm sticking by them. Well, these are my thoughts, people do differ, so its unfortunate that some people out there are unhappy with the game, but oh well, that's life for you.