I've been gone awhile... about 8 months. I came back less than 2 weeks ago and been updating myself with builds and all that stuff.
I wanted to talk about one thing and that's Blood Lance vs. Pest Lance. Don't believe the hype! The #1 player on solo leaderboards with a solo gr of 121 is Trag's Blood Lance. Just because popular streamers with 4k paragon post a vid clearing gr100 doesn't really mean it's a good build. 4k paragon and rank 110+ gems plays a huge factor in completing such rifts. What you need to base judgement on is how two different builds perform at some base level with equal gear and sheet damage.
I tested both builds at GR 90 with the EXACT same sheet dps. Trag's dramatically did more damage than Pest. It wasn't even close.
Aside from the damage there is survivability and Trag's is 3x better with better dps. So, why run Pest? Idk, because some streamer claims it to be better than Trag's and they get brainwashed. Remember, the #1 player in the world uses Trag's. He must know something, right?
Anyway, test this yourself. You'll find out that MY findings are very accurate.
Sometimes I think streamers are just like movie commercials. "The #1 Movie in the World!" Like ten #1's on the same day.
You will eventually realize that most players just go with trends. For example, when Necro was first released everyone played Inarius when I already knew Trag'Oul's was superior to any Inarius build. But I could not convince anyone since the leaderboards said otherwise. Lo and behold 2-3 weeks later everyone converted to Trag builds. This is the same thing that happens every season. Everyone plays Pest but to me it's just a trend. Trag'Oul's is just as good if not better in my opinion.
What makes you think that the top player is trag? I'm not saying you're wrong - I can't see what gear he was wearing when he did the 121 clear but currently he's using pestilence with mostly level 130 augments.
I definitely agree that the status quo builds should be challenged. I haven't tried trags much myself.
From my understanding, ignoring other multipliers:
Trags fires a 1750% weapon dmg lance + a 525% lance from you, both receiving 3,300% dmg. This means around 75,000 * weapon damage. It also provides toughness from healing and blood rush runes.
Pestilence fires a 1,750% lance and another from consuming the corpse. These receive 1,650% boost from pestilence set. That's 57,000 * weapon damage. Some toughness is given from the 4 set bonus too.
Based on that alone, trag does more damage.. but pestilence allows you to take brittle touch rune, skip all CHC on gear, allowing you to prioritise attack speed, crit damage and CDR, while still having 100% crit chance on important fights. They're very similar builds and probably compete well. Trag may win with imperfect gear but I think at the absolute max/min level, pestilence wins out due to the gear optimisation and crit rune.
OP yes Trag single target damage is way above Pest. But that's about it. The thing with Pest is that it destroys trash while you're sniping elites which is important for clearing high keys while also ensuring max crit on targets which diminishes the gap between pest and trag's ST damage. 90 is not a great measure of set power btw. It's kind of like the new 70 for most classes after the balancing act blizz did. Trag was really good a year ago when all we did was snipe elites and yea it's defense is easier than say Pest but both play similarly except you actually care about grouping up trash to slaughter alongside your elite target. Hope this sheds some light on why the change.
Viewing Hero Details shows what build he completed the rift in which was with Trag'Ouls.
I kid you not... D3 is all about fanboys. People just play whatever is trending regardless of what's better.
Perfect example:
Last season (S13), everyone became MS fanboys with UE set but the better build was actually M6. Why was everyone playing UE MS? Because of streamers.
You can throw whatever numbers out if you want. I did my own testing and a lot of it. I probably ran a few hundred GR90's with Trag & Pest. I came to my own conclusions.
OP yes Trag single target damage is way above Pest. But that's about it. The thing with Pest is that it destroys trash while you're sniping elites which is important for clearing high keys while also ensuring max crit on targets which diminishes the gap between pest and trag's ST damage. 90 is not a great measure of set power btw. It's kind of like the new 70 for most classes after the balancing act blizz did. Trag was really good a year ago when all we did was snipe elites and yea it's defense is easier than say Pest but both play similarly except you actually care about grouping up trash to slaughter alongside your elite target. Hope this sheds some light on why the change.
That seems like more opinion or "play style" than anything. You're wrong about testing things at GR90. You always choose a base to test anything in any game or aspect. That's the only way you can get accurate results. When you do a few dozen GR's or even hundreds of GR's at the same Tier with the same exact sheet damage and get the same exact results then you know which build outperforms the other. Lots of players don't even give Trag'Oul's a chance because of all the Pest fanboys. Most people I've come across never even played Trag'Oul's. They hit 70 and immediately farm Pest gear just because of what streamers are currently trending. If the top streamers were promoting Trag'Oul's for S13 then everyone would be playing that build. That's how D3 works for the most part.
I'm not saying Pest is bad at all. I'm just saying people get swayed by streamers to think certain specs are better than others. Lots of streamers are complete BS I tell you. Lord Fluffy, (sorry, to call that guy out) but almost all of his builds are nonsense. But, you'll notice that all of his vid titles say "Best Farming", "Best Speed", "Best Build Ever", etc. All of his groupies play these subpar builds and next thing you know, the game is flooded with people thinking they are good builds. Even though these builds are really bad, people "upvote" the builds by the hundreds on Diablo Fans. D3 is almost as bad as real life politics when it comes to builds.
At the end of the day, you will play whatever you're comfortable with or find fun. If you want to be an ignorant groupie and follow whatever some streamer tells ya or follow outdated Icy Veins every season then that's your perogative.
Hi ALL!
I've been gone awhile... about 8 months. I came back less than 2 weeks ago and been updating myself with builds and all that stuff.
I wanted to talk about one thing and that's Blood Lance vs. Pest Lance. Don't believe the hype! The #1 player on solo leaderboards with a solo gr of 121 is Trag's Blood Lance. Just because popular streamers with 4k paragon post a vid clearing gr100 doesn't really mean it's a good build. 4k paragon and rank 110+ gems plays a huge factor in completing such rifts. What you need to base judgement on is how two different builds perform at some base level with equal gear and sheet damage.
I tested both builds at GR 90 with the EXACT same sheet dps. Trag's dramatically did more damage than Pest. It wasn't even close.
Aside from the damage there is survivability and Trag's is 3x better with better dps. So, why run Pest? Idk, because some streamer claims it to be better than Trag's and they get brainwashed. Remember, the #1 player in the world uses Trag's. He must know something, right?
Anyway, test this yourself. You'll find out that MY findings are very accurate.
Sometimes I think streamers are just like movie commercials. "The #1 Movie in the World!" Like ten #1's on the same day.
You will eventually realize that most players just go with trends. For example, when Necro was first released everyone played Inarius when I already knew Trag'Oul's was superior to any Inarius build. But I could not convince anyone since the leaderboards said otherwise. Lo and behold 2-3 weeks later everyone converted to Trag builds. This is the same thing that happens every season. Everyone plays Pest but to me it's just a trend. Trag'Oul's is just as good if not better in my opinion.
What makes you think that the top player is trag? I'm not saying you're wrong - I can't see what gear he was wearing when he did the 121 clear but currently he's using pestilence with mostly level 130 augments.
I definitely agree that the status quo builds should be challenged. I haven't tried trags much myself.
From my understanding, ignoring other multipliers:
Trags fires a 1750% weapon dmg lance + a 525% lance from you, both receiving 3,300% dmg. This means around 75,000 * weapon damage. It also provides toughness from healing and blood rush runes.
Pestilence fires a 1,750% lance and another from consuming the corpse. These receive 1,650% boost from pestilence set. That's 57,000 * weapon damage. Some toughness is given from the 4 set bonus too.
Based on that alone, trag does more damage.. but pestilence allows you to take brittle touch rune, skip all CHC on gear, allowing you to prioritise attack speed, crit damage and CDR, while still having 100% crit chance on important fights. They're very similar builds and probably compete well. Trag may win with imperfect gear but I think at the absolute max/min level, pestilence wins out due to the gear optimisation and crit rune.
OP yes Trag single target damage is way above Pest. But that's about it. The thing with Pest is that it destroys trash while you're sniping elites which is important for clearing high keys while also ensuring max crit on targets which diminishes the gap between pest and trag's ST damage. 90 is not a great measure of set power btw. It's kind of like the new 70 for most classes after the balancing act blizz did. Trag was really good a year ago when all we did was snipe elites and yea it's defense is easier than say Pest but both play similarly except you actually care about grouping up trash to slaughter alongside your elite target. Hope this sheds some light on why the change.
Viewing Hero Details shows what build he completed the rift in which was with Trag'Ouls.
I kid you not... D3 is all about fanboys. People just play whatever is trending regardless of what's better.
Perfect example:
Last season (S13), everyone became MS fanboys with UE set but the better build was actually M6. Why was everyone playing UE MS? Because of streamers.
You can throw whatever numbers out if you want. I did my own testing and a lot of it. I probably ran a few hundred GR90's with Trag & Pest. I came to my own conclusions.
That seems like more opinion or "play style" than anything. You're wrong about testing things at GR90. You always choose a base to test anything in any game or aspect. That's the only way you can get accurate results. When you do a few dozen GR's or even hundreds of GR's at the same Tier with the same exact sheet damage and get the same exact results then you know which build outperforms the other. Lots of players don't even give Trag'Oul's a chance because of all the Pest fanboys. Most people I've come across never even played Trag'Oul's. They hit 70 and immediately farm Pest gear just because of what streamers are currently trending. If the top streamers were promoting Trag'Oul's for S13 then everyone would be playing that build. That's how D3 works for the most part.
I'm not saying Pest is bad at all. I'm just saying people get swayed by streamers to think certain specs are better than others. Lots of streamers are complete BS I tell you. Lord Fluffy, (sorry, to call that guy out) but almost all of his builds are nonsense. But, you'll notice that all of his vid titles say "Best Farming", "Best Speed", "Best Build Ever", etc. All of his groupies play these subpar builds and next thing you know, the game is flooded with people thinking they are good builds. Even though these builds are really bad, people "upvote" the builds by the hundreds on Diablo Fans. D3 is almost as bad as real life politics when it comes to builds.
At the end of the day, you will play whatever you're comfortable with or find fun. If you want to be an ignorant groupie and follow whatever some streamer tells ya or follow outdated Icy Veins every season then that's your perogative.
Can you pls recommend a Trag'Oul's guide, video or text?
Here's the general build. Offhand is optional. You mainly want it for stats such as 8% CDR.
https://www.diablofans.com/builds/91053-corpseless-blood-lancer-gr-push-meta