U Mother Fucker U Need To Rot In Hell U Commy Bastard Wath Is Wrong With YOU!? Oh The God Dam Terrist Never Hit The Trade Towers Where The Fuck Did U Get That Asshole Ur Fucked Up U Are Not A Amercican And U Never Will Be U Sorry Sob Go Fuck Urself Terrist Bastard. ALSO I MIGHT NOT LIKE PRESIDENT BUSH BUT AT LEAST HE NOT BEING A PUSSY AND HES GETTIN THE JOB DOWN BY KILLIN THE GOD DAM TERRORIST! THE ONL THING HE COULD HAVE DONE BETTER WOULD HAVE TO SENT MOR SOLIDERS OR NUKE THE WHOLE GOD DAM MIDDLE EAST ALONG WITH KOREA. The reason i say this because the middle east is like a hydra u cut one bad head and u get 2 mor. Plz excuse my laughage to those youger audiences and those that this offend except te person that wrote this thread. o and just for the record i would want to do the same as muttonchops except the end effect wit u in the middle east full of american hating terorist that would kill u in the most painful way possible.
Where to start....first of all, not all people in the Middle East and South West Asia are terrorists. You're a racist for saying that. Which brings you that much closer to being just as bad as a terrorist. But you're right, committing genocide is definitely the answer to this terrorist attack. After all, 1000000 Muslims dead=6000 Americans dead, right? I mean, there is no chance that there is an innocent soul in the Middle East, right? I'm sure they're all strapping bombs to their chests at this very moment. Making sweeping generalizations about any group of people is stupid and you should refrain from doing it, lest you become something along the lines of groups such as the KKK and Neo-Nazis.
Now, I'd have to say Bush handled this so-called War on Terrorism as well as a retard in a pool without waterwings. Sure, he tried, but he's failing miserably. But sure, let's give him credit anyways. I mean, in a country where we give trophies to little kids who get their ass kicked in soccer, that's the least we could do, right?
did you know that china and iran and russia are becoming big friends?? dont we have problems with iran?? is it possible that if we declare war on iran russia and china will step in?? is it possible that we can cripple russia if we control its oil??
Hold on there, China and Russia have been allies for quite a long time. This goes way back to the Cold War and the spread of Communism.
if you call us evil, then who is the good?? the us has always held the torch for freedom and democracy, right and justice.
Holy shit, you're ignorant. Who is to judge that democracy is for everyone, for starters. I happen to appreciate my country and such. And to say that America is the only good in this world is the most self-righteous and stupid thing to say. You're basically implying that no one else knows what is right, without the U.S. to lead the way.
Democracy doesn't necessarily work for everyone just cuz it worked for us. That is for many reasons. One of them being that countries in the Middle East prodominantly consist of Muslims. It may be hard to grasp, but people have different mindsets in different parts of the world based on religion, among other things. So the concept of democracy may not seem like the best option for them. Especially since they prefer to operate on religious beliefs.
well, if you guys insist, i will continue. lets see....
Hold on there, China and Russia have been allies for quite a long time. This goes way back to the Cold War and the spread of Communism.
stick to the real issue. why are you bashing the way i said something if your not gonna get the real message?? yes china and russia go way back, but are lately strengthening freindships with iraq.
Holy shit, you're ignorant. Who is to judge that democracy is for everyone, for starters. I happen to appreciate my country and such. And to say that America is the only good in this world is the most self-righteous and stupid thing to say. You're basically implying that no one else knows what is right, without the U.S. to lead the way.
when did i say that the US is the only good?? in fact, i believe something like you. i believe that the US is flawed, but where i and many others disagree is that no matter the wrongs that my country has done before, we have given so much to the world and that the good we do overweights the bad. here, a demonstration for those who didnt get that.
US bads done<US good done
at no point did i declare that this country is perfect or the only good in the world. what i did say is that we have always held the torch for freedom and democracy. (inaccuracy i know, we began to hold that torch after WWII) if you guys werent so angry at this country you would see what we have done for the world. i dont have the complete list, but here is a starters list:
-Declared and successfully achieved independence from britain (the world power at the time)
-beat the british at an attempt to take over our country (pwned them at new orleans)
-helped mexico declare independence
-joined the first world war and helped the allies beat the axis powers
-went to WW2 after the japanese atrocities at pearl harbor
-pwned the japs
-led operation d-day where we retook control of france and pwned the germans soon after
(note= if we wouldnt of had entered the war, hitler would have overtaken all of europe and soon after the countries around it, until he secured his power over all asia and africa with the help from the japs.)
-brought down the soviets in the race for who was the better country. (if you guys didnt know, the us and ussr competed to outdo the other, to produce more than the other, and bring the other down by economic pressure. we won)
-put a the first man on the moon
-revolutionized the world of computers
and to make it better, we also led the world in the technological aspect, from making the first light bulb, to the first nuke, to the internet, and to the job market we have today. we have given so much to the world, and this my reason for believing that the US is the best country this planet has seen.
You have the U.S. pinned up as the epitome of good. And based on the phrasing of your statement, you said that there is no good without the U.S.
I do not need a list of points in order to understand what you're main point is. A lack of proper phrasing seems to be the only problem. I picked up your statement in a quote, so I did not quite have as much of a subtle approach.
and to make it better, we also led the world in the technological aspect, from making the first light bulb, to the first nuke, to the internet, and to the job market we have today. we have given so much to the world, and this my reason for believing that the US is the best country this planet has seen.
That's debatable. If you are talking about the country that has invented the most vital tools of civilization, I would have to say that Rome probably has it beat. If you are talking in terms of possession of technology, countries like Japan have us beat by miles.
ok, i can do the exact same thing as u did and thus declare Greece as the country that held the torch of freedom too!
-Declared and successfully achieved independence from britain (the world power at the time)
- Declared and successfully achieved independence from the Osman Empire (a considerably powerfull empire during that time).
-beat the british at an attempt to take over our country (pwned them at new orleans)
-beat the Osmans at their attempt to take over our country (pwned them at many different places).
-helped mexico declare independence
-helped Cyprus declare independence
-joined the first world war and helped the allies beat the axis powers
just as it stands. Done it before you did, btw. (except perhaps that Axis was only at WW2)
-went to WW2 after the japanese atrocities at pearl harbor
-went to WW2 right at the start by not allowing the Axis forces to run freely through our country and supply their both fronts in Africa and to the east of europe.
-pwned the japs
-pwned the italians (the 2nd strongest army in europe after the Nazis).
-led operation d-day where we retook control of france and pwned the germans soon after
(note= if we wouldnt of had entered the war, hitler would have overtaken all of europe and soon after the countries around it, until he secured his power over all asia and africa with the help from the japs.)
-Managed to successfully delay the Germans from getting easy access to Africa. Cut off their supplies, also delayed their troops. Result? They got caught off in the hard, Russian winter and got pwned by the Russians there - was about the time u decided to attack the nazis in europe. Yes, the war was almost over at the time. The Africa front was mainly held by the English rebels. We also sent support there too besides interrupting the germans in any possible way.
-brought down the soviets in the race for who was the better country. (if you guys didnt know, the us and ussr competed to outdo the other, to produce more than the other, and bring the other down by economic pressure. we won)
-we're better lovers than all of you (its just as relevant)
-put a the first man on the moon
how did it help us(the world)? Getting the first man in space is more important - and it wasnt u that sent the first man in space, i think.
-revolutionized the world of computers
not more than the japs did. And btw most the companies that actually revolutionized the world of computers are international. They're only based in the US.
one more thing:
US bads done<US good done
i didnt see u mentioning any bad things... the few things u said as plus points are pretty subjective too.
in my eyes ur just too proud to see that to the rest of the world the US arent that well thought of.
Think of that and do something about it and then what u want to think of ur country might come true too (i really want a good superpower around - too bad theres none around atm).
*last second edit*
i also forgot to mention that Greece (even in more ancient times), was the first to define politics, democracy, science, philosophy and art. (that should be on top of the reply but to hell, i just remembered it).
Well, just like Americans are pissed off about 9-11, I'm sure that there's many, many countries who are pissed at the US and the most un-debatable gift it has given to the world: civilian casualties. It's a shame when any civilians get killed, and surely whoever 'did' 9-11 needs to be bought to justice, but c'mon.. surely the American leaders who've killed far more civilians overseas deserve to be bought to justice aswell?
Sorry to add to this but y'know.. it's not the American people that probably 80% of the world's population disagrees with, or even hates, but the track record it's war-hungry presidents have given it. 9-11 was a retaliation, just like the invasion of Iraq was (wrong people though, d'oh!)
And to boast about how powerful American military might is? I'll not go into it in detail, but..
Vietnam. There's so much hatred for America in Iraq right now that it's a sure bet the new generations are pretty much ALL being taught to join in with the jihad.. there's no way that America will root out all resistance there, short of nuking the country and starting again. But then, that's not the answer is it? It's just a shame that other moron leaders like Tony Blair don't figure this out and join in on the glorified game of cowboys and indians aswell
i had to quote it.
By far the best reply i've seen so far. I kept saying it myself. But the fact remains that this "retaliation" happened when Bush needed it to open fire at Iraq that was about to sell oil to Europe in european currency (dollar prices started dropping already).
But as you said: The ones that had to pay for it (with their lives) were innocent people, in both the US and Iraq. Its tragic to see people defending these stupid war hungry pricks.
Well, there are no good wars, and if people that were responsible for wars were to be charged by it, no one would start them. And not many would retaliate. But when it is war the leaders have to be able to do everything to ensure victory. That does not mean however that I support Iraq, they did not have any "supposed" nukes. But when you're in there you have to stick with it, even if the decision was stupid to begin with.
PlugY for Diablo II allows you to reset skills and stats, transfer items between characters in singleplayer, obtain all ladder runewords and do all Uberquests while offline. It is the only way to do all of the above. Please use it.
Supporting big shoulderpads and flashy armor since 2004.
Their is no end to terrorism. There will always be jealousy, hate, greed, and need. If one country expresses this and the other country has what the other doesn't, there will be terrorism.
I understand this for my 3 uncles, 1 cousin and 1 grandfather who has been or is in the United States Army/Marines. I honor those who defend our country from terrorism.
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Those before me shall quiver in my wake as I unleash the fury within!
The ones that had to pay for it (with their lives) were innocent people, in both the US and Iraq.
The innocent always suffer as a result of war. It's a rule of thumb.
Its tragic to see people defending these stupid war hungry pricks.
I hope you're not talking about me. In which case I'd have to say that it's tragic that you're only seeing a sliver of my basis.
First, I'll start off with my opinion (based on factual evidence, mind you)
The Iraq War was initially a good idea. Saddam Hussein killed over 61,000 Iraqi civilians, during his reign, that have been found. According to many human rights groups, there are approximately 500,000 that have been buried in mass graves. Approximately 41 locations have been confirmed and accounted for in terms of casualties. Another 270 locations are suspected to have dead civilians buried.
Approximately 100,000 casualties, were caused by the Iraq War. I can't find how many were civilians and how many were militant Iraqis. I did not take my information from places such as iraqbodycount.org for the reason that the number of civilian casualties may be slightly embelished. So this larger number includes opposition as well. But about half of them are civilians, give or take. America casualties rate about 2500.
Considering that the majority of sources put Saddam's number killed far above Bush's, between Desert Storm and now, it would seem that removing such a tyrant from power was overall, a good thing.
However, due to the lack of intelligence and proper procedure on Bush and his administration's part, the casualties are far above what they would be, had it been handled by a more competant president. In effect, this war has caused a backlash for America.
I defend the war, not how it was handled. Bush did a terrible job and managed to make even more enemies than what we had initially.
On the subject of WWII, I would just like to say, Fingolfin, on the pure basis of reality, countries like the British would not have made it, had America not jumped in. There would not have been enough soldiers for a successful D-Day, and there would have not been enough pressure on Germany's western front in order for them to collapse from being enclosed by the Russians, North Africa and the West, at the time of the end of the war. At best, the war would have ended a few years later than it did.
''our soldiors died for my freedom of speech''
I find that quote to be rather innaccurate. Or at least, not from an intelligent source.
seems like a giant pisstake to both the soldiors who most of wouldn't have actually wanted to be there, and the innocents that were killed in setting up this system of ''well, we've sacrificed our sons and daughters, our country is automatically great''
What soldier in their right mind, would want to go to war, unless they had a death wish? Trust me, I am absolutely positive that Britain has sent soldiers against their will repeatedly throughout history. It's not a matter of killing our children that supposedly makes our country great. It's the fact that America, during WWII, maintained superiority, defeating Japan, which was renowned for its naval arsenal, as well as lending a huge hand in the ultimate defeat of Germany. And from that point, America has been a super power and has been declared great.
Using the death of innocents is not a logical reason for mitigating the purpose of a war. Innocents will always die. However, a good deal could have been done in order to minimize casualties. But, such is the nature of war.
Their is no end to terrorism. There will always be jealousy, hate, greed, and need.
Jealousy, hate, greed and need are not intermingling ideas within the concept of terrorism. Although you are right that there is no end to terrorism. Which is why the idea of declaring war on a word is ridiculous. It's even more far-fetched than a war on drugs.
To add to Muttonchops excellent information, during WWII, who was the country who was strong enough to fight 2 wars at the same time on both sides of the country?
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Those before me shall quiver in my wake as I unleash the fury within!
I haven't read every reply in here, but I would like to reply to whoever said that there is a lot of hate towards America in Iraq right now.
You need to stop watching the news and talk to some real people. Real soldiers who were really there. Its a COMPLETELY different story than what we see on the news and read in the paper.
I heard something about power outages in places in Iraq and of course the media was blaming it on troops or bombings or whatnot. Talked to a soldier, he said the reason for the power shortages (not outages) was because hundreds of people actually had the opportunity to get and use Air Conditioning for the first time. It wasn't our bombings, it was them actually recieving luxuray for the first time!
Theres tons of stories with even happier endings all throughout Iraq. Yeah, of course, some people still hate us, but for the most part our troops are getting welcomed with open arms.
i didnt really mean you. I mostly ment the ones that think the way the Bush administration handled it was the right one. It was really based on economical reasons and not for the freedom of Iraq, be honest with that. Its also a plain fact that Saddam was set there and supported by former US governments.
Anyway, the war in Iraq atm is far from over. Not just the one between the rebels and the US/international forces there. There's also a civil war far more devastating than the bombing there (Saddam, no matter how much i may dislike him, managed to keep balance between certain factions and keep peace in a relative way).
if you hold the american leaders responsible for casualties in other countries, you must be willing to accept that leaders in other countries are responsible for casualties too. the reason i say this, is because using your reasoning would mean that lincoln was responsible for the millions of americans killed during the civil war.
to get back to you fing, i think that you just dont want to accept america. i think you have something against this country, and that you are just too stubborn to accept everything we have done. the list i gave was to state just some of the goods we have done, since no one else will state them. and you feel that the US is not a good superpower huh?? who would you like to be a superpower?? who would do a better job?? if you know then tell us. the US is one of the most giving countries ever. there is no other country that gives more than us.
that is what i have to say, about my reasons to love this country the way i do. let me paint the picture for you. think of someone you love, it could be your mom, dad, brother, sister, girlfried, boyfriend, wife, husband, anyone. now think about all the good times you have together, all the good things about that person. now remember all the bad things, the fights or the things that person does or has done. compare them for a bit, dont the good ones outweigh the bad?? that is the love i have for my country, and if you think that i dont know the bads, i do. but when others talk bad about someone you love, dont you throw that aside and defend that person?? it doesnt matter if its true, you direct your rage at the offender.
that is the love and passion one should have for his/her country. now give me more stuff i am too thick headed to accept. o and by the way, greece did play a role in the world, but the greatest it ever was in ancient times. they are just a shadow of what they once were. the greece slowed down german advance, the US is the main reason the germans lost. see that?? please use a better example than greece.
i didnt really mean you. I mostly ment the ones that think the way the Bush administration handled it was the right one. It was really based on economical reasons and not for the freedom of Iraq, be honest with that. Its also a plain fact that Saddam was set there and supported by former US governments.
there arent many that believe the operation was handled the right way. what everyone does argue though, is that it was the right thing to do. yes it was a economic reason, but also for the freedom of those iraqis. south of baghdad there were three mass graves, each containing 12,000 to 17,000 corpses. that doesnt count the other burials being found all over iraq. it was a genocide of his own people, and frankly someone that is crazy to do something like that to his own people gets me scared for those people. so i think that yes the freedom did play a large role in this, its just that the media is so negative that they refuse to show people that side of the story.
about our supporting iraq as former US governments, i know two things.
1. there has only been one US government for the entire history of the US
2. yes we did screw up, but isnt that our responsibility? to fix our problem??
sorry for the post, i started the one above this morning and found more posts when i got home from school.
if you hold the american leaders responsible for casualties in other countries, you must be willing to accept that leaders in other countries are responsible for casualties too.
i hold the ones that declared War responsible for most of the casualties during that war, yes. In that way of thinking, Austria was the major trouble maker in WW 1, Germany in WW2 and the US in Iraq. Quite logical, dont u think?
i think you have something against this country, and that you are just too stubborn to accept everything we have done.
as u said there are good and bad things that happened in this country. But the majority of the things that come out of it arent that good. I dont know how things in there are, i dont really care either. What i know and dont like is that atm, the US are the global bully if not worse.
and you feel that the US is not a good superpower huh?? who would you like to be a superpower?? who would do a better job??
i mentioned in a previous post but u probably refuse to understand. There is no other superpower atm. That fill you (the US) with arrogance. That allows u to commit illegal if not criminal acts against other countries without having to fear about the consequences. Thats not showing any righteous causes i think. On the opposite.
There is no other supowerpower and theres none ready to be a supowerpower. Not even yourselves are ready to be one.
please use a better example than greece.
if u consider how much less things Greece had to achieve what they (we) achieved its a pretty big deed. Also considering how big each country is. Try to scale things too.
And talking about firepower? Yeah, the US has the upper hand atm. But is that what matters? Not really. What i see is a big gap in there between technological and cultural advance. Sooner or later they all come down... its all a matter of how.
one last thing:
2. yes we did screw up, but isnt that our responsibility? to fix our problem??
fucking a place up once gives u the right to fuck it up again, eh? I dont see any problem solved atm. And once again: It wasnt about fixing a mistake either. Its about that "mistake" doing something that you dont want them to do.
i didnt want to invade iraq in the first place... however i will support our troops no matter what, any country should do this, they have fought at least one war to defend your freedom
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If you ever meet a hafling and a hungry dragon you dont have to outrun the dragon, you only have to outrun the hafling.
has anyone ever thought of "calling the troops back"?
What most people dont get in here is that what the US did to Iraq was INVASION. Is that legal? NO. period. end of story. The rest is just excuses.
Where to start....first of all, not all people in the Middle East and South West Asia are terrorists. You're a racist for saying that. Which brings you that much closer to being just as bad as a terrorist. But you're right, committing genocide is definitely the answer to this terrorist attack. After all, 1000000 Muslims dead=6000 Americans dead, right? I mean, there is no chance that there is an innocent soul in the Middle East, right? I'm sure they're all strapping bombs to their chests at this very moment. Making sweeping generalizations about any group of people is stupid and you should refrain from doing it, lest you become something along the lines of groups such as the KKK and Neo-Nazis.
Now, I'd have to say Bush handled this so-called War on Terrorism as well as a retard in a pool without waterwings. Sure, he tried, but he's failing miserably. But sure, let's give him credit anyways. I mean, in a country where we give trophies to little kids who get their ass kicked in soccer, that's the least we could do, right?
Hold on there, China and Russia have been allies for quite a long time. This goes way back to the Cold War and the spread of Communism.
Holy shit, you're ignorant. Who is to judge that democracy is for everyone, for starters. I happen to appreciate my country and such. And to say that America is the only good in this world is the most self-righteous and stupid thing to say. You're basically implying that no one else knows what is right, without the U.S. to lead the way.
Democracy doesn't necessarily work for everyone just cuz it worked for us. That is for many reasons. One of them being that countries in the Middle East prodominantly consist of Muslims. It may be hard to grasp, but people have different mindsets in different parts of the world based on religion, among other things. So the concept of democracy may not seem like the best option for them. Especially since they prefer to operate on religious beliefs.
stick to the real issue. why are you bashing the way i said something if your not gonna get the real message?? yes china and russia go way back, but are lately strengthening freindships with iraq.
when did i say that the US is the only good?? in fact, i believe something like you. i believe that the US is flawed, but where i and many others disagree is that no matter the wrongs that my country has done before, we have given so much to the world and that the good we do overweights the bad. here, a demonstration for those who didnt get that.
US bads done<US good done
at no point did i declare that this country is perfect or the only good in the world. what i did say is that we have always held the torch for freedom and democracy. (inaccuracy i know, we began to hold that torch after WWII) if you guys werent so angry at this country you would see what we have done for the world. i dont have the complete list, but here is a starters list:
-Declared and successfully achieved independence from britain (the world power at the time)
-beat the british at an attempt to take over our country (pwned them at new orleans)
-helped mexico declare independence
-joined the first world war and helped the allies beat the axis powers
-went to WW2 after the japanese atrocities at pearl harbor
-pwned the japs
-led operation d-day where we retook control of france and pwned the germans soon after
(note= if we wouldnt of had entered the war, hitler would have overtaken all of europe and soon after the countries around it, until he secured his power over all asia and africa with the help from the japs.)
-brought down the soviets in the race for who was the better country. (if you guys didnt know, the us and ussr competed to outdo the other, to produce more than the other, and bring the other down by economic pressure. we won)
-put a the first man on the moon
-revolutionized the world of computers
and to make it better, we also led the world in the technological aspect, from making the first light bulb, to the first nuke, to the internet, and to the job market we have today. we have given so much to the world, and this my reason for believing that the US is the best country this planet has seen.
I do not need a list of points in order to understand what you're main point is. A lack of proper phrasing seems to be the only problem. I picked up your statement in a quote, so I did not quite have as much of a subtle approach.
That's debatable. If you are talking about the country that has invented the most vital tools of civilization, I would have to say that Rome probably has it beat. If you are talking in terms of possession of technology, countries like Japan have us beat by miles.
- Declared and successfully achieved independence from the Osman Empire (a considerably powerfull empire during that time).
-beat the Osmans at their attempt to take over our country (pwned them at many different places).
-helped Cyprus declare independence
just as it stands. Done it before you did, btw. (except perhaps that Axis was only at WW2)
-went to WW2 right at the start by not allowing the Axis forces to run freely through our country and supply their both fronts in Africa and to the east of europe.
-pwned the italians (the 2nd strongest army in europe after the Nazis).
-Managed to successfully delay the Germans from getting easy access to Africa. Cut off their supplies, also delayed their troops. Result? They got caught off in the hard, Russian winter and got pwned by the Russians there - was about the time u decided to attack the nazis in europe. Yes, the war was almost over at the time. The Africa front was mainly held by the English rebels. We also sent support there too besides interrupting the germans in any possible way.
-we're better lovers than all of you (its just as relevant)
how did it help us(the world)? Getting the first man in space is more important - and it wasnt u that sent the first man in space, i think.
not more than the japs did. And btw most the companies that actually revolutionized the world of computers are international. They're only based in the US.
one more thing:
i didnt see u mentioning any bad things... the few things u said as plus points are pretty subjective too.
in my eyes ur just too proud to see that to the rest of the world the US arent that well thought of.
Think of that and do something about it and then what u want to think of ur country might come true too (i really want a good superpower around - too bad theres none around atm).
*last second edit*
i also forgot to mention that Greece (even in more ancient times), was the first to define politics, democracy, science, philosophy and art. (that should be on top of the reply but to hell, i just remembered it).
i had to quote it.
By far the best reply i've seen so far. I kept saying it myself. But the fact remains that this "retaliation" happened when Bush needed it to open fire at Iraq that was about to sell oil to Europe in european currency (dollar prices started dropping already).
But as you said: The ones that had to pay for it (with their lives) were innocent people, in both the US and Iraq. Its tragic to see people defending these stupid war hungry pricks.
I understand this for my 3 uncles, 1 cousin and 1 grandfather who has been or is in the United States Army/Marines. I honor those who defend our country from terrorism.
I hope you're not talking about me. In which case I'd have to say that it's tragic that you're only seeing a sliver of my basis.
First, I'll start off with my opinion (based on factual evidence, mind you)
The Iraq War was initially a good idea. Saddam Hussein killed over 61,000 Iraqi civilians, during his reign, that have been found. According to many human rights groups, there are approximately 500,000 that have been buried in mass graves. Approximately 41 locations have been confirmed and accounted for in terms of casualties. Another 270 locations are suspected to have dead civilians buried.
Approximately 100,000 casualties, were caused by the Iraq War. I can't find how many were civilians and how many were militant Iraqis. I did not take my information from places such as iraqbodycount.org for the reason that the number of civilian casualties may be slightly embelished. So this larger number includes opposition as well. But about half of them are civilians, give or take. America casualties rate about 2500.
Considering that the majority of sources put Saddam's number killed far above Bush's, between Desert Storm and now, it would seem that removing such a tyrant from power was overall, a good thing.
However, due to the lack of intelligence and proper procedure on Bush and his administration's part, the casualties are far above what they would be, had it been handled by a more competant president. In effect, this war has caused a backlash for America.
I defend the war, not how it was handled. Bush did a terrible job and managed to make even more enemies than what we had initially.
On the subject of WWII, I would just like to say, Fingolfin, on the pure basis of reality, countries like the British would not have made it, had America not jumped in. There would not have been enough soldiers for a successful D-Day, and there would have not been enough pressure on Germany's western front in order for them to collapse from being enclosed by the Russians, North Africa and the West, at the time of the end of the war. At best, the war would have ended a few years later than it did.
I find that quote to be rather innaccurate. Or at least, not from an intelligent source.
What soldier in their right mind, would want to go to war, unless they had a death wish? Trust me, I am absolutely positive that Britain has sent soldiers against their will repeatedly throughout history. It's not a matter of killing our children that supposedly makes our country great. It's the fact that America, during WWII, maintained superiority, defeating Japan, which was renowned for its naval arsenal, as well as lending a huge hand in the ultimate defeat of Germany. And from that point, America has been a super power and has been declared great.
Using the death of innocents is not a logical reason for mitigating the purpose of a war. Innocents will always die. However, a good deal could have been done in order to minimize casualties. But, such is the nature of war.
Jealousy, hate, greed and need are not intermingling ideas within the concept of terrorism. Although you are right that there is no end to terrorism. Which is why the idea of declaring war on a word is ridiculous. It's even more far-fetched than a war on drugs.
You need to stop watching the news and talk to some real people. Real soldiers who were really there. Its a COMPLETELY different story than what we see on the news and read in the paper.
I heard something about power outages in places in Iraq and of course the media was blaming it on troops or bombings or whatnot. Talked to a soldier, he said the reason for the power shortages (not outages) was because hundreds of people actually had the opportunity to get and use Air Conditioning for the first time. It wasn't our bombings, it was them actually recieving luxuray for the first time!
Theres tons of stories with even happier endings all throughout Iraq. Yeah, of course, some people still hate us, but for the most part our troops are getting welcomed with open arms.
i didnt really mean you. I mostly ment the ones that think the way the Bush administration handled it was the right one. It was really based on economical reasons and not for the freedom of Iraq, be honest with that. Its also a plain fact that Saddam was set there and supported by former US governments.
Anyway, the war in Iraq atm is far from over. Not just the one between the rebels and the US/international forces there. There's also a civil war far more devastating than the bombing there (Saddam, no matter how much i may dislike him, managed to keep balance between certain factions and keep peace in a relative way).
to get back to you fing, i think that you just dont want to accept america. i think you have something against this country, and that you are just too stubborn to accept everything we have done. the list i gave was to state just some of the goods we have done, since no one else will state them. and you feel that the US is not a good superpower huh?? who would you like to be a superpower?? who would do a better job?? if you know then tell us. the US is one of the most giving countries ever. there is no other country that gives more than us.
that is what i have to say, about my reasons to love this country the way i do. let me paint the picture for you. think of someone you love, it could be your mom, dad, brother, sister, girlfried, boyfriend, wife, husband, anyone. now think about all the good times you have together, all the good things about that person. now remember all the bad things, the fights or the things that person does or has done. compare them for a bit, dont the good ones outweigh the bad?? that is the love i have for my country, and if you think that i dont know the bads, i do. but when others talk bad about someone you love, dont you throw that aside and defend that person?? it doesnt matter if its true, you direct your rage at the offender.
that is the love and passion one should have for his/her country. now give me more stuff i am too thick headed to accept. o and by the way, greece did play a role in the world, but the greatest it ever was in ancient times. they are just a shadow of what they once were. the greece slowed down german advance, the US is the main reason the germans lost. see that?? please use a better example than greece.
US>most of the world
yes i said it.
there arent many that believe the operation was handled the right way. what everyone does argue though, is that it was the right thing to do. yes it was a economic reason, but also for the freedom of those iraqis. south of baghdad there were three mass graves, each containing 12,000 to 17,000 corpses. that doesnt count the other burials being found all over iraq. it was a genocide of his own people, and frankly someone that is crazy to do something like that to his own people gets me scared for those people. so i think that yes the freedom did play a large role in this, its just that the media is so negative that they refuse to show people that side of the story.
about our supporting iraq as former US governments, i know two things.
1. there has only been one US government for the entire history of the US
2. yes we did screw up, but isnt that our responsibility? to fix our problem??
sorry for the post, i started the one above this morning and found more posts when i got home from school.
i hold the ones that declared War responsible for most of the casualties during that war, yes. In that way of thinking, Austria was the major trouble maker in WW 1, Germany in WW2 and the US in Iraq. Quite logical, dont u think?
as u said there are good and bad things that happened in this country. But the majority of the things that come out of it arent that good. I dont know how things in there are, i dont really care either. What i know and dont like is that atm, the US are the global bully if not worse.
i mentioned in a previous post but u probably refuse to understand. There is no other superpower atm. That fill you (the US) with arrogance. That allows u to commit illegal if not criminal acts against other countries without having to fear about the consequences. Thats not showing any righteous causes i think. On the opposite.
There is no other supowerpower and theres none ready to be a supowerpower. Not even yourselves are ready to be one.
if u consider how much less things Greece had to achieve what they (we) achieved its a pretty big deed. Also considering how big each country is. Try to scale things too.
And talking about firepower? Yeah, the US has the upper hand atm. But is that what matters? Not really. What i see is a big gap in there between technological and cultural advance. Sooner or later they all come down... its all a matter of how.
one last thing:
fucking a place up once gives u the right to fuck it up again, eh? I dont see any problem solved atm. And once again: It wasnt about fixing a mistake either. Its about that "mistake" doing something that you dont want them to do.
the entire world praising the Reich Fuhrer
What most people dont get in here is that what the US did to Iraq was INVASION. Is that legal? NO. period. end of story. The rest is just excuses.