Putting a new twist and fuel on an old flame, I'm interested to see what people think. Personally I'm fine with all the above, but everyone is different. With hostility being the most aggressive form and no pvp as the least aggressive, we all have a line to or not to draw, what say you?
Hostility, consensual dueling mid game, and player organized PvP. So Diablo 2. Funny, a game where PvP was an "after thought" has more control and features opposed to Diablo 3 so far where we have limited everything.
Hostility, consensual dueling mid game, and player organized PvP. So Diablo 2. Funny, a game where PvP was an "after thought" has more control and features opposed to Diablo 3 so far where we have limited everything.
Diablo 2 just had completely unstructured PvP as I mentioned in another thread. Diablo 3 has structured PvP, when you add structure it creates limitations. Those limitations aren't always a bad thing. I have a feeling we'll have team vs team, dueling, and possibly even FFA once the official PvP system launches. Hostility, and mid-game dueling aren't good systems for Diablo 3...so it makes perfect sense for us to not have them.
Expecting competitive and structured PvP as part of Diablo 3 will just get your hopes up. Blizzard has specifically stated that they are actually staying away from being an eSport...intentionally. PvP in Diablo 3 will be casual according to everything we've seen, and should actually get more players into PvP then if it was more competitive. If that means you hate the game and don't want to play it...don't. You wouldn't buy other games you don't like, this can just be another game you don't buy.
pvp in diablo 2 was completely biased based on your class some classes werent even viable at all in pvp
Yup. It was horribly unbalanced and based on class and gear. There was not matchmaking to make sure that you fought equally geared players. Since people bought gear on D2 quite heavily, you couldn't even really compete unless you also bought gear. Not really that fun unless you're an ultra-hardcore PvP nut really.
yeah and for the most part the auradin was dominating pvp due to his aura stack glitch and almost all paladin builds were op
Im gonna have to stop you right there buddy. Auaradins were only effective because of a glitch and a hack, also paladins were very beatable. Just because you didn't have the right build or strategy to do so does not make it overpowered. This is what gives PvP a bad name, people who don't know how to PvP having a say about it.
Hurricane elemental druid would stomp:
LEGIT auaradin, Hammerdin, charger, zealer, FOH, smiter. Best bet a paladin has in that duel is a lucky invis hammer, a greatly timed charge and charge stun, or a charge to a smite stun to death.
In fact, every class can beat every class. So to say that 1 was overpowered is just ridiculous.
yeah and for the most part the auradin was dominating pvp due to his aura stack glitch and almost all paladin builds were op
Im gonna have to stop you right there buddy. Auaradins were only effective because of a glitch and a hack, also paladins were very beatable. Just because you didn't have the right build or strategy to do so does not make it overpowered. This is what gives PvP a bad name, people who don't know how to PvP having a say about it.
Hurricane elemental druid would stomp:
LEGIT auaradin, Hammerdin, charger, zealer, FOH, smiter. Best bet a paladin has in that duel is a lucky invis hammer, a greatly timed charge and charge stun, or a charge to a smite stun to death.
In fact, every class can beat every class. So to say that 1 was overpowered is just ridiculous.
Honestly, D2 PvP wasn't balanced well at all. Diablo 3 PvP won't be competitively balanced either, most likely. In a game where a large amount of your power depends on items and your abilities are mostly designed at wiping out hordes of monsters...competitive PvP balance isn't something you shoot for. This is why I've continually said...PvP in D3 will be casual...period.
adon i did point out the glitch did you read or did you just impulsively troll on me
Right, so you pointed out a glitch...that Blizzard was to lazy to patch? Ok so beyond a 1 off glitch, which was still beatable might I add...what else was so overpowering and god tier? Why don't you stop saying ignorant stuff, and answer the questions I placed out for you?
ecutruin:
How was d2 pvp unbalanced? What was so unbalanced about it? Name it and I will tell you exactly why it was balanced and what to do about it. Just because you guys never cared to learn the game, doesn't mean it was broken. I am not asking for balance, or esports or anything buddy so stop bringing it up, you are like a broken record. Is Street Fighter unbalanced and broken and everything because a few people can't handle spacing, pokes, inputs, match ups? I don't think so.
How was d2 pvp unbalanced? What was so unbalanced about it? Name it and I will tell you exactly why it was balanced and what to do about it. Just because you guys never cared to learn the game, doesn't mean it was broken. I am not asking for balance, or esports or anything buddy so stop bringing it up, you are like a broken record. Is Street Fighter unbalanced and broken and everything because a few people can't handle spacing, pokes, inputs, match ups? I don't think so.
How was it unbalanced?...Any AoE class with high end gear and teleport could quite easily wipe the floor with almost any player from my experience. In addition, without any sort of matchmaking system...there was no way to 'learn' effectively unless you buy items or spend months farming just to get into PvP at all (almost every PvP game I joined had one of the above teleport killers). This isn't balanced play. Its elitist play that is only fun for hardcore players that want highly competitive PvP....
Guess what?... That's not Diablo 3! Blizzard has stated themselves that if features would create an impression of eSport PvP, they will intentionally avoid adding it. Their goal is to focus on a more casual PvP experience and create system that works well alongside PvM. If you're looking for highly competitive and organized PvP, you need to look at a different game. This doesn't make Diablo 3 a bad game or Blizzard a bad company for not giving you the features. Games aren't ever going to be for everyone. Diablo 3 was designed for PvM gamers first, that's just the way things are.
How was d2 pvp unbalanced? What was so unbalanced about it? Name it and I will tell you exactly why it was balanced and what to do about it. Just because you guys never cared to learn the game, doesn't mean it was broken. I am not asking for balance, or esports or anything buddy so stop bringing it up, you are like a broken record. Is Street Fighter unbalanced and broken and everything because a few people can't handle spacing, pokes, inputs, match ups? I don't think so.
How was it unbalanced?...Any AoE class with high end gear and teleport could quite easily wipe the floor with almost any player from my experience. In addition, without any sort of matchmaking system...there was no way to 'learn' effectively unless you buy items or spend months farming just to get into PvP at all (almost every PvP game I joined had one of the above teleport killers). This isn't balanced play. Its elitist play that is only fun for hardcore players that want highly competitive PvP....
Guess what?... That's not Diablo 3! Blizzard has stated themselves that if features would create an impression of eSport PvP, they will intentionally avoid adding it. Their goal is to focus on a more casual PvP experience and create system that works well alongside PvM. If you're looking for highly competitive and organized PvP, you need to look at a different game. This doesn't make Diablo 3 a bad game or Blizzard a bad company for not giving you the features. Games aren't ever going to be for everyone. Diablo 3 was designed for PvM gamers first, that's just the way things are.
I don't know...I know plenty of people over my 10 years of playing Diablo that learned PvP just fine. Also, a charger paladin can rock any class if they are good enough. A smiter can rock any class if good enough. A zerk barb can rock any class if good enough, and definitely a bone necro can rock any class if good enough...none of these classes are AOE classes and can do all of that with out teleport. Again, just because you had a bad experience and never learned how to play that part of the game doesn't make it unbalanced.
Again..what the hell are you talking about haha? So them allowing me to play 1v7, ect is creating a competitive and esports feeling? Are you high? Them restricting everything is doing nothing but killing the fun out of the game for a lot of people, even as a casual thing this PvP with your hands tied blows and is only a 1 off thing then it will be old news. It must boil down to their latest development thought process where the consumer is to stupid to make their own decisions so daddy Blizzard better do it for them right?
I don't know...I know plenty of people over my 10 years of playing Diablo that learned PvP just fine. Also, a charger paladin can rock any class if they are good enough. A smiter can rock any class if good enough. A zerk barb can rock any class if good enough, and definitely a bone necro can rock any class if good enough...none of these classes are AOE classes and can do all of that with out teleport. Again, just because you had a bad experience and never learned how to play that part of the game doesn't make it unbalanced.
Again..what the hell are you talking about haha? So them allowing me to play 1v7, ect is creating a competitive and esports feeling? Are you high? Them restricting everything is doing nothing but killing the fun out of the game for a lot of people, even as a casual thing this PvP with your hands tied blows and is only a 1 off thing then it will be old news. It must boil down to their latest development thought process where the consumer is to stupid to make their own decisions so daddy Blizzard better do it for them right?
I would love to see Arena in the game but I would also want some Hostility like it was in D2. It was so frustrating to get killed in hostility when you didn't want to be killed but it's so fun to kill someone else when it's going on. It spices up the game.
But the Problem is that the game onl allows 4 people at a time to play so it would be great if another system was added that works like World of Warcraft battleground system. that would be really fun.
Well again ecutruin you pointed out nothing. Nothing that I was suggesting gives off a competitive or a esport mentality, in fact it goes directly against that thought process. You are so wound up in this whole esport thing and so scared shit-less that some PvP'er is going to run in your game and fuck you up that you obviously can't help but bring up esports and how "broken" pvp was in d2 and how it isn't the focus in every thread ha.
Now again, how was D2 PvP broken? I have given you all perfect examples thus far how you thought it was broken but the only thing broken was your lack of knowledge of the mechanics.
All of them but Hostility. The only way I'd be okay with hostility is if you could toggle it on (the default is off) in the game settings, and you're made aware the instant someone goes hostile.
And even like this the system is kinda uninteresting. It just lends itself to senseless ganking. No one is gonna go hostile if it's a fair fight. Dueling is just as good if you want a legitimate fight.
All of them but Hostility. The only way I'd be okay with hostility is if you could toggle it on (the default is off) in the game settings, and you're made aware the instant someone goes hostile.
And even like this the system is kinda uninteresting. It just lends itself to senseless ganking. No one is gonna go hostile if it's a fair fight. Dueling is just as good if you want a legitimate fight.
Dueling is fine, it is kind of pointless and annoying to have to stop mid game, leave the game and join a new game just to duel. It should all be one motion. Maybe give us a WP to the arena in the same game, could solve a lot of problems. Hostility while it was used for ganking yes, it provided a much more dynamic game experience. Which is why it should be an option when creating or searching for a game. Can't honestly tell me it is hard to code in a little hostile button, since D1 and D2 had it what 10+ years ago.
For people that are going to say "BUT BUT BUT leaving mid game will disrupt our flow of PvM and we all have to stop if someone wants to duel!!!". Maybe it might, I don't know, personally I don't see D3 being that difficult, no harder then lightning monsters in D2 and no harder then Lord De Sis with a barbarian, right strategy and they fall easy. For a counter argument here, ok so we disrupted your flow with our duel...what if we go to town to trade, or repair or whatever....arn't we disrupting your flow that way? It is no different, unless you are scared to admit that people actually like to duel in Diablo......
Well again ecutruin you pointed out nothing. Nothing that I was suggesting gives off a competitive or a esport mentality, in fact it goes directly against that thought process. You are so wound up in this whole esport thing and so scared shit-less that some PvP'er is going to run in your game and fuck you up that you obviously can't help but bring up esports and how "broken" pvp was in d2 and how it isn't the focus in every thread ha.
Now again, how was D2 PvP broken? I have given you all perfect examples thus far how you thought it was broken but the only thing broken was your lack of knowledge of the mechanics.
It's not only my view that it was broken...others also have found it broken. I haven't played Diablo 2 PvP in like 5 years. Expecting me to remember every little thing about it is just silly. What I do remember of it was that it just wasn't fun. Super twinked out characters basically killed everyone and generally camped you from even getting your body. That was my experience with PvP in Diablo 2.
As to your comment about me being 'scared'...do you even read what you post? Insulting other posters is a great way to get taken seriously, right? No, I'm not 'scared' of hostility...I don't ENJOY people coming into my game, flagging, and killing people that are trying to progress. It's not a fun experience for most people, which is why many games in Diablo 2 that were trying to progress content were either rushes, runs, or private passworded games. Funny enough, this poll says the majority feels the same way.
Now, tell me how hostility would be better for Diablo 3. Tell me how you're views on how the game's PvP would actually make the game better. Diablo 3 is nearly done, its core development and design focused on PvM. What would be so beneficial to the community AS A WHOLE that it'd be worth the development resources to implement? Use some logic behind your posts, instead of insults.
Diablo 2 just had completely unstructured PvP as I mentioned in another thread. Diablo 3 has structured PvP, when you add structure it creates limitations. Those limitations aren't always a bad thing. I have a feeling we'll have team vs team, dueling, and possibly even FFA once the official PvP system launches. Hostility, and mid-game dueling aren't good systems for Diablo 3...so it makes perfect sense for us to not have them.
Expecting competitive and structured PvP as part of Diablo 3 will just get your hopes up. Blizzard has specifically stated that they are actually staying away from being an eSport...intentionally. PvP in Diablo 3 will be casual according to everything we've seen, and should actually get more players into PvP then if it was more competitive. If that means you hate the game and don't want to play it...don't. You wouldn't buy other games you don't like, this can just be another game you don't buy.
Yup. It was horribly unbalanced and based on class and gear. There was not matchmaking to make sure that you fought equally geared players. Since people bought gear on D2 quite heavily, you couldn't even really compete unless you also bought gear. Not really that fun unless you're an ultra-hardcore PvP nut really.
Hurricane elemental druid would stomp:
LEGIT auaradin, Hammerdin, charger, zealer, FOH, smiter. Best bet a paladin has in that duel is a lucky invis hammer, a greatly timed charge and charge stun, or a charge to a smite stun to death.
In fact, every class can beat every class. So to say that 1 was overpowered is just ridiculous.
Honestly, D2 PvP wasn't balanced well at all. Diablo 3 PvP won't be competitively balanced either, most likely. In a game where a large amount of your power depends on items and your abilities are mostly designed at wiping out hordes of monsters...competitive PvP balance isn't something you shoot for. This is why I've continually said...PvP in D3 will be casual...period.
ecutruin:
How was d2 pvp unbalanced? What was so unbalanced about it? Name it and I will tell you exactly why it was balanced and what to do about it. Just because you guys never cared to learn the game, doesn't mean it was broken. I am not asking for balance, or esports or anything buddy so stop bringing it up, you are like a broken record. Is Street Fighter unbalanced and broken and everything because a few people can't handle spacing, pokes, inputs, match ups? I don't think so.
This.
How was it unbalanced?...Any AoE class with high end gear and teleport could quite easily wipe the floor with almost any player from my experience. In addition, without any sort of matchmaking system...there was no way to 'learn' effectively unless you buy items or spend months farming just to get into PvP at all (almost every PvP game I joined had one of the above teleport killers). This isn't balanced play. Its elitist play that is only fun for hardcore players that want highly competitive PvP....
Guess what?... That's not Diablo 3! Blizzard has stated themselves that if features would create an impression of eSport PvP, they will intentionally avoid adding it. Their goal is to focus on a more casual PvP experience and create system that works well alongside PvM. If you're looking for highly competitive and organized PvP, you need to look at a different game. This doesn't make Diablo 3 a bad game or Blizzard a bad company for not giving you the features. Games aren't ever going to be for everyone. Diablo 3 was designed for PvM gamers first, that's just the way things are.
Again..what the hell are you talking about haha? So them allowing me to play 1v7, ect is creating a competitive and esports feeling? Are you high? Them restricting everything is doing nothing but killing the fun out of the game for a lot of people, even as a casual thing this PvP with your hands tied blows and is only a 1 off thing then it will be old news. It must boil down to their latest development thought process where the consumer is to stupid to make their own decisions so daddy Blizzard better do it for them right?
I'm going to avoid retyping a large post so I'll just link you to this...
http://www.diablofans.com/topic/29635-bring-hostility-back/page__view__findpost__p__814260
But the Problem is that the game onl allows 4 people at a time to play so it would be great if another system was added that works like World of Warcraft battleground system. that would be really fun.
Now again, how was D2 PvP broken? I have given you all perfect examples thus far how you thought it was broken but the only thing broken was your lack of knowledge of the mechanics.
And even like this the system is kinda uninteresting. It just lends itself to senseless ganking. No one is gonna go hostile if it's a fair fight. Dueling is just as good if you want a legitimate fight.
For people that are going to say "BUT BUT BUT leaving mid game will disrupt our flow of PvM and we all have to stop if someone wants to duel!!!". Maybe it might, I don't know, personally I don't see D3 being that difficult, no harder then lightning monsters in D2 and no harder then Lord De Sis with a barbarian, right strategy and they fall easy. For a counter argument here, ok so we disrupted your flow with our duel...what if we go to town to trade, or repair or whatever....arn't we disrupting your flow that way? It is no different, unless you are scared to admit that people actually like to duel in Diablo......
It's not only my view that it was broken...others also have found it broken. I haven't played Diablo 2 PvP in like 5 years. Expecting me to remember every little thing about it is just silly. What I do remember of it was that it just wasn't fun. Super twinked out characters basically killed everyone and generally camped you from even getting your body. That was my experience with PvP in Diablo 2.
As to your comment about me being 'scared'...do you even read what you post? Insulting other posters is a great way to get taken seriously, right? No, I'm not 'scared' of hostility...I don't ENJOY people coming into my game, flagging, and killing people that are trying to progress. It's not a fun experience for most people, which is why many games in Diablo 2 that were trying to progress content were either rushes, runs, or private passworded games. Funny enough, this poll says the majority feels the same way.
Now, tell me how hostility would be better for Diablo 3. Tell me how you're views on how the game's PvP would actually make the game better. Diablo 3 is nearly done, its core development and design focused on PvM. What would be so beneficial to the community AS A WHOLE that it'd be worth the development resources to implement? Use some logic behind your posts, instead of insults.