Yes, but If low level PvP is supported, it wouldn't fix it here (when most damage come from spell itself and not gear)..
I know.. it's not a big deal.. It's just low level PvP noone care about..but fact is ratio between "damage from skill" and "damage from gear" is slowly shifting from one extreme to another during leveling process and beyond.
Not saying they shouldn't change damage for PvP..but it's really a bit tricky without flat values.
They said they can have mechanics like reduced durations and stuff for pvp, not completely different damage numbers
I assume you're referring to Jay Wilson's quote on their "snowy system" which is the system that's already implemented to separate PvP and PvE ability effects when necessary.
What he ACTUALLY said was that it would get "tricky" when tweaking damage numbers. I would think the vast majority of design development would be classified as "tricky." Tricky doesn't mean it can't be done. It just means it might take a little effort. Explain to me what else the "PvP team" is responsible for if not this?
idk what's so hard about tweaking dmg
-20% dmg on pvp for all skills so hard
-30% on really high hitting skills so hard
Because we have no idea how scaling works.. for example WoW.. most spells benefit from stats/spell power differently.. so you just can't lower base damage.. because .. it could change scaling in big way, or it wouldn't makes much difference when most spell power are from items anyway... This is probably the tricky part.
It would prob be best to lower the scaling componenets on the spells so gear doesn't change that much btw
They said they can have mechanics like reduced durations and stuff for pvp, not completely different damage numbers
I assume you're referring to Jay Wilson's quote on their "snowy system" which is the system that's already implemented to separate PvP and PvE ability effects when necessary.
What he ACTUALLY said was that it would get "tricky" when tweaking damage numbers. I would think the vast majority of design development would be classified as "tricky." Tricky doesn't mean it can't be done. It just means it might take a little effort. Explain to me what else the "PvP team" is responsible for if not this?
Wait... you're assuming that even anywhere CLOSE to a majority of gamers read up enough to know that it wouldn't be a priority. I'm sorry, but you're dead wrong. Most of the people who would use a pvp system wouldn't read enough to nkow that, they would use it and be STRONGLY angered and disappointed that it wasn't balanced. Why? Because it was in the game, and it damnwell should be balanced if it's there and ranked!
Most of the people ON THIS FORUM would read enough to know that, but I guarantee you this forum represents the BAREST minority of people interested in d3.
The PvP community isn't SMALL AT ALL, and we would make best use of what we get. All we want is the foundations leave the rest to the PvP community to sort out brah.
I'd love all these "features" and I don't really think people would bitch about it, because everybody would know beforehand "the design philosophy".
I don't think they should just stay 100% away from it, specially if they know we'll turn it into a major deal. Just make sure it's fully featured and let people know that balance won't be a "top priority" and we'll never have "PvP specific items" - that would be good enough.
Although anything like a "wager" system would be decent enough for me, just to have fun with my friends. And maybe just a "symbolic reward" - like being able to sell "ears" for gold =P
There's a pretty simple reason not to make pvp majorly competetive.
Once you put in a system where people are ranked, then you have to work on balance. This game isn't like WoW where you have a pretty finite number of builds or sc2 where you have a finite number of units. This game has in the millions of potential combinations per character. Balancing that would probably take decades of work... and do you REALLY want the game to be delayed to 2042 just so they can put in a solid competetive pvp system? That is of course assuming balancing it would even be POSSIBLE with that many combinations.
not necessarily
but STILL I don't see the problem with balancing a bit
if they notice a build raping too hard in PvP all they have to do is lower their dmg a bit but it's not necesarilly needed
They didn't make a elaborated PvP systen because they didn't have time to do it. D3 development took quite a time (we all know that T_T) and PvP are not something easy to do. A good PvP game requires a lot of attention and development and they barely finished the PvE part of the game in time (beta might begin at any momment and the rune systen, one of the game's signature, is not even ready to run!).
They basically don't have time to balance and creat a PvP systen until the release. So they prefer to not put a lot of PvP content in the game because they don't want a lot of people playing pvp and seeing the uggly and unpolished side of the game.
From the release, people should problably spend time playing PvE and doing the achievements wich is surely the very very polished part of D3. Sooner or later part of the community will get tired of it and will start to demand more pvp attention. By there they will have more skill / item data for the balance and more time too plan things better. Then the pvp content will be launched when they are ready to do it.
all they have to do is change spell dmg/stun times/slow times for PvP for balance(in the process of doing that)
Make a ranking (they have that done but it's in invisible form all they have to do is make it visible)
Make a matchmaking system (in the process of doing that)
Make TDM AND LSM options (they already have LSM designed pretty much - blizzcon)
They can easily polish all they already started by shipping date
By forming two different PvP game types you segregate the community.
"What rank are you in PvP right now?"
"I only play non-ranked."
"N00b!"
That's how it'll happen.. This is a reason they don't want an E-sport. Not to mentioned the need for the separation of auction house gear for each PvP type.. Just between those two changes you'd split the game another four ways, farther separating parts of the fanbase.. Hardcore mode is understandable since it's a whole different style of playing the game. A ranked PvP will be no different from regular PvP in play style.
Also the reason PvP is so prevalent in D2 I find to be painfully obvious.. The game is very old, all the the content has been played out, played again, beaten dead with a paddle, resurrected, then shackled to a rock and left for the birds; the only thing left is PvP.. Blizzard North was very slow, and under-par with their expansions, and content additions. Blizzard is known for having full and challenging expansions, not to mention occasional content additions on the fly to keep things fresh. Diablo 3 won't be left to slowly wither away was Diablo 2 was.
So make the noobs happy and no one else? What kind of logic is that? Too bad if it segegrates them.
That's not why. D3 will be the same since all Diablo games are basically a gear grind.
I feel Blizzard's choice so far to avoid hyper a competitive PvP environment is for the best of the fanbase as a whole. Being as non-bias as possible, seeing as I support the choice, I feel in order to be competitive, you have to save stats. Be it win/loss ratios, K/D ratios, fastest kill time, or any other in game happenings, the fact is that no one wants flaws saved on their account for anyone and everyone to see. People obsess over these smudges on their record so much, they'll buy whole accounts for loads of money with better records just so that number 75% turns into a 87%. Frankly, I feel there are enough E-sport games out there right now between console and PC.
On the second tier of reasoning, one could mention that with the real money auction house in place having a competitive atmosphere would lead to people buying more ( <- key word here) items from the auction house, or third party sites. Yes, people will be buying items to win PvP matches, but if you increase the competitiveness that number of people buying items will sore. Is this necessarily a bad thing? It could be, but that's not really the point. The point is it would be fueling a concept that Diablo itself doesn't stand for, and the development team doesn't see fit for the game as a whole.
All and all I will enjoy PvP as just another way to play my character, not to keep a tight win/loss record. All the more reason I support a noncompetitive PvP system.
Every time I see the word e-sport being correlated with D3 my faith on humanity dies by a significant %. No1 wants an E-Sport
A non ranked PvP-Mode and ranked mode can be implemented TAAAAA DAAHH!
I don't really care if the development team doesn't see PvP as a big part of the game. The reality is that PvP is a big part of D2. Like it or not by the end of diablo (1.5years) the majority of D2 consisted in PvPing. If PvP became such a huge part of D2 shouldn't the D3 developing team try to make the PvP system even better than in D2 to allow for it to flourish even more?
It would prob be best to lower the scaling componenets on the spells so gear doesn't change that much btw
-20% dmg on pvp for all skills so hard
-30% on really high hitting skills so hard
but STILL I don't see the problem with balancing a bit
if they notice a build raping too hard in PvP all they have to do is lower their dmg a bit but it's not necesarilly needed
all they have to do is change spell dmg/stun times/slow times for PvP for balance(in the process of doing that)
Make a ranking (they have that done but it's in invisible form all they have to do is make it visible)
Make a matchmaking system (in the process of doing that)
Make TDM AND LSM options (they already have LSM designed pretty much - blizzcon)
They can easily polish all they already started by shipping date
Then as time passes they can keep polishing
So make the noobs happy and no one else? What kind of logic is that? Too bad if it segegrates them.
That's not why. D3 will be the same since all Diablo games are basically a gear grind.
Gear grind -> PvP
that's why
A non ranked PvP-Mode and ranked mode can be implemented TAAAAA DAAHH!
I don't really care if the development team doesn't see PvP as a big part of the game. The reality is that PvP is a big part of D2. Like it or not by the end of diablo (1.5years) the majority of D2 consisted in PvPing. If PvP became such a huge part of D2 shouldn't the D3 developing team try to make the PvP system even better than in D2 to allow for it to flourish even more?
http://forums.battle.net/thread.html?topicId=27822632733&postId=278201088621&sid=3000#0