DiabloFans

Have fun.

I remember back in the day before online gaming existed I played a game because it was fun. Paying attention to things such as immersion, art style, UI, music, storyline etc etc. I never once lived for the thrill of stroking my ego to the point where I needed to be fighting someone online to enjoy it.

There is a clear cut difference between my generation and that which currently plagues a majority of the Diablo 3 official forums and NOW it seems the diablofans forums. Kind of sad.

Quote from ScP_Iodine

From all the posts on jay wilsons twitter about a blizzard staff 4 man group not even finishing act 1 I'm not worried about the difficulty. It's really all up to an individual perspective on what is difficult and what isn't. They can't please everyone no matter what they do but they can design a damn good game.
Im sure they have tested nightmare, hell, and inferno a lot internally with different levels of gear and what not. On this particular decision I'm trusting that they know what they're doing

Pretty much this, I love how everyone is a backseat game designer. Has been pretty entertaining over the last 4 years reading kids cry about literally nothing they comprehend. Internal testing > all opinions.

Even better:

Explain your reasoning behind the build in full detail and not expect us to do more than you have in a reply post.

Build 1: http://us.battle.net...RScd!bVd!YYabbc
Build 2 (Revised): http://us.battle.net...RScd!YVd!YYabac


UP TO DATE CALC AND REVISED BUILD 3: http://d3db.com/tool/calculator/barbarian/13405

Changes - Ravage on rend for more targets hit, replaced Nerves of Steel with Weapon Master.
Overview:
I love seismic slam. So much so that I wanted to be able to use it way more frequently.

With that out of the way, I'm build a 1H + Shield build that uses Overpower, Leap attack, War Cry, being struck in combat,Revenge and base weapon attacking while bellow 15 to generate fury.

This is a high Vitality build concentrating around thorns, seismic slam, rend and revenge to do damage.

It will not by any means kill things faster than your build, however; damage reduction is very high, supported by an escape / initiation, constant life leach and very good Dot Damage.

Primary Item Affix Values (IAV) :
3 - Armour
3 - Vitality
2.5 - Thorns
2 - Strength
2 - +Damage
1.5 - Movement Speed %
?? (More to come)


On the Offence:
Seismic Slam is a fantastic barbarian ranged attack that allows for kitting if needed giving immense health regen through the Bloodthirst passive when striking multiple enemies. The cone arc on this skill is gigantic, I love it. Another use for Seismic slam is clustering mobs into walls or corners thanks to the huge knock back cone which is a great synergy to Rend.

Leap attack, Rend and Overpower all work together very well, getting your Come at me Bro barbarian the most bang for his cooldown buck. Essentially Overpower's damage is not extreme, but it's an amazing fury generator on a relatively short cooldown. Rend is an extremely undervalued Fury spender that does massive damage in an AOE over time. Leap attack is universally acceptable in almost any build simply because it can be modified to be an offensive or defensive staple.

On the Defence:

War Cry is pretty self explanatory; directly increasing the effectiveness of Thorns and character survival through more armour and 10% more max life. A great support buff to all team mates.

Subject to change depending on the need to generate more fury or not I will be switching the rune on Revenge to Provocation if I see that more healing is required.

Seismic Slam as mentioned above is a great tool to use if a quick retreat or spacing is required.



This thread is also a general discussion surrounding Rend and its usefulness.

Comments, your changes and props all welcome!
All trolls will be reported.

At first I thought you saw my post on the Diablo 3 forums and copied my build haha. Well here's my iteration of the WoTB build:

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/barbarian#WfUReP!YZS!abZZbc

Very similar but with a few tweaks for higher uptime on WoTB and more survivability. I like Marathon on sprint quite a bit, give the most bang for your buck IMO for keeping you in combat.

Your only healing as well is Revenge which is not really benefiting from Dodge% on sprint.

Uh shield is totally viable on DH, my build relies on not using any ranged weapons and equipping a heavy defensive shield with a high damage 1h melee weapon.

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/demon-hunter#hWgjZQ!eVb!YaZbZa

Haters gon' hate
Bill gates gon' gate.

You're picking fly shit out of pepper.

Quote from Adon

So do it then, what about D3 is so superior to D2? What is flawed about D2? I feel the skill system ,stat system, gear system, PvP system, teaming system, ect are all superior in D2. I feel in D3 that the PvP is a gimmick and is unmanageable unlike in D2, the skill system is a rushed pile of garbage with no real choice, the stat system insults the player by saying they are to stupid to properly stat their character, and the items system piggybacks off the stat system to try and make up for the fact every barbarian is the same.

Your turn buddy.

Burden of proof isn't on me. The developers have always stated their reasoning for their decisions on their various blog posts with each major beta patch, very clearly, and very concisely. That's your justification. Go read that again until you can actually form an argument against it. Plus, I'm getting exactly the game I want - I don't have to do a damn thing to convince anyone of anything.

By all means though, you can continue in the corner crying for that justification. It'll never come of course, and D3 will continue marching along completely oblivious of your needs.

No offense, but I don't think you quite adequately grasp this cooldown concept. This is a common argument I see often from people who have not even thought about the situation beyond the surface.

This is not WoW. 120 second cooldown does not mean you will be fighting for 120 seconds before it is up again. There are so many circumstances where two minutes have passed and little has happened. ACTUAL up-time of this ability will be much, much higher than 1/8th-1/6th because your time spent fighting is not 100% of the time. Even if you are surrounded by mobs you will want to position yourself a certain way. I imagine this will become increasingly important for Inferno.

If you have seriously thought about this, you would have factored in: the time you spend running around (whether during combat or simply to get to the next mob/place) the time you spend going back to town after having a full inventory, 'mini breaks' (washroom), practically any and every time you spend doing something other than attacking. Which amounts to a decent length of time. A two minute cooldown really will not feel the same way it does in WoW. On that front, I am certain that this perspective will hold true for me and many other individuals.

As per the "spammy versus cooldown" models. This game has changed because the player base has changed. It is no longer fun for the majority of people playing video games to spam one or two spells over and over. People also want things that are incredibly strong. There are many psychological aspects at play here that Blizzard has always utilized well in their video games. To use conjectural phrases like "silly" to refer to someone else's argument and opinion is ironic. Please avoid little ad hominem arguments as they only reveal that the person making them is often subject to the same criticism they are making of another.

Diablo 3 will define the Diablo franchise. This is because it will become so wide spread and popular as to overshadow its predecessors. The game needs to have spam spells and cooldown spells. They are trying to balance this game around a fun and interesting decision making process along with balance against monsters and for the PVP system they plan to implement in the future. It would be difficult to balance a Diablo 3 PVP system if you have your strongest hitting abilities available on short cooldowns.

I would implore more posters to try to have thought through their problems with the game, instead of reiterating and regurgitating someone else's thoughtless rant about a particular subject matter.

don't plan!

i recommend gamers like you just to play the game, if you find an ability you like and you think its fu*king awesome... use it! the game is made to be played kinda how ever you want. play to have fun!

once you learn more and get more experienced you can start optimizing. but thats really not so important in the start, it will come automatically! when you really stop and think... "hey... what if i use these skills.. then i can use that combo and get more use of this skill" then your on a good track.

The game is built in sutcha way that you get 1 or more skills and runes every level giving you change to test them out and then make your own choices.
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edit, adding more about my way of thinking:

I got some ideas of how i might want to built my characters, but who knows? maybe i need more stun skills, less area of effect skills... i don't know! i got an idea that i might follow, but will do whatever feels awesome.

Discussions on how much money people claim they will make selling items for cash have plagued these forums since the RMAH was announced. Most of them claim outrageous sums based on nothing but glorified theorycrafting and an incredible misunderstanding of market economies.

There are a hundred different reasons farming/selling items won't be lucrative (for most people), which have been discussed to death. We could discuss how the market will be flooded with supply and have minimal demand, driving prices into the dirt (a penny for a thousand gold? try a penny per 100,000). We could discuss how there will only be as much money available on the RMAH as people put into it. We could discuss drop rates versus reasonable returns.

But there's a fundamental reason why it will be absurdly difficult to make any real money on the RMAH that forms the basis for virtually every other reason:

Players aren't working for items. They're playing for them.

In the real world it's reasonable to charge someone five bucks for a burger that takes a matter of minutes to make, because it takes work to make it, and requires equipment. People will pay 5$ so they don't have to put in the time or make the initial investment, even if it's a bad deal in the long run.

In Diablo, everyone will have the equipment to acquire items, because the game is everything you need. Further, acquiring items isn't work, it's fun. You are playing the game for fun and acquire items as rewards. This drives the cost/time ratio way down, as it would take an incredibly long grind to dissuade players from doing it themselves.

Think of your own play. If I told you that you could buy an item for 5$ that you could get by playing the game for 10 hours, you would tell me to go fuck myself. Shit, 10 hours? That's nothing. That's a few days, max, and I don't have to pay anyone, plus I'll probably get other items. And unless I'm really burned out on the game (in which case I probably wouldn't be interested anyway), those hours of play will be enjoyable.

Now, you're already getting terrible returns at 5$ for 10 hours of work. That's 50 cents per hour, basically sweatshop wages. However, the ratio of how long it will take to farm an item compared to what people will be willing to pay for it is much worse. The breaking point where people are likely to give you that much money is going to start in the 20-25 hour range. Maybe even later. That's 20-25 cents per hour.

This is not taking into account the massive influx of items the market will experience, and the fact that players will purchase off of the gold auction house whenever possible, or any of the other incredibly obvious problems.

If you can achieve a reward through having fun playing the game, the price drops considerably right off the bat. BEFORE market considerations.

Here's my prediction for the for the life-cycle of the RMAH:

1.) Everyone and their dog will post items here. The number of listings will skyrocket, and the prices will generally be set at what the seller thinks of as reasonable (IE way too high)
2.) There will be almost no RMAH sales. Most listings will expire.
3.) Prices will steadily decline, and few people will sell on the RMAH. Most listings will still go un-sold.
4.) After a few weeks, when prices have dropped down low enough, the RMAH will begin to pick up. People will start to get endgame drops in reasonable numbers, and good ones will sell for a few dollars a pop. These types of items will be the ones requiring dozens of hours of farming to get a single one.
5.) As endgame items spread through the economy, with a large portion of the playerbase being level sixty and most of them farming for themselves (2-3 month range), prices will begin a steady decline again. This decline will remain steady until the expansion releases and a new set of top-tier items are added.
6.) New top-tier items and content will restart this cycle, but with a much shorter timespan for the first 4 steps. Rinse and repeat with each expansion.

Quote from HDiTwiek

Burzghash, friend - its a simple fact that blizzard killed their newest makings ( wotlk , cataclysm, starcraft 2... ) with making the games "accessible" to everyone. examples.

Ok, I'll humor you.

Quote from HDiTwiek

starcraft 2 = extreme retarded coinflip shitgameplay. played it ? go play it hardcore straight for 1 year and think about it.

Well that's certainly irrefutable scientific logic if I've ever seen it. Would you care to actually back your stance that SC2 = extreme retarded coinflip shitgameplay? More importantly, how about linking us to your SC2 profile to demonstrate to us that you actually have some measure of deeper understanding of SC2's gameplay? If you have specific criticisms about SC2, it appears that they're related to game balance. How does having an imbalanced game benefit casuals? Hint: Casuals want a well-balanced game just as much as anyone else, where the outcome is determined by player skill rather than luck of the draw. Arguing otherwise is disingenuous.

Quote from HDiTwiek

wow ? wow was a damn nice mmorpg while it was released, even back in burning crusade it was top notch. after casualing down the whole game, its stupid as fuck. content gets patched in and bashed in 2 weeks, including the "hardcore community content" like heroic raids. whats when nobody bashed the content in 4 weeks? well, they just nerf everything to the ground. here an example.... the firelands-raid. the raid was real nice in design and fight-mechanics. after a little bit about 5 weeks after content release 6 out of 7 bosses were nerfed to death in heroics, suddenly you could do it random instead of trying it for hours with your mates - thats not funny.

5 weeks for the tip-top cream of the crop of players to beat the content? Players who were likely already incredibly geared and experts in the game? That sounds pretty well done to me. But that might be because I'm actually taking the whole picture into consideration; that only an incredibly minute fraction of players were downing those heroic raids in 5 weeks. The overwhelmingly large remainder of the population wasn't coming close to downing the content in just 5 weeks. Do you have a link to your WoW profile that shows you having beat the heroic raids?

Quote from HDiTwiek

weakening the first quarter / half of inferno even before its released is fitting into this trend,

Correlation does not equal causation.

Quote from HDiTwiek

and it annoys me. blizzard claimed that the inferno difficulty would be only for the "hardcore community" since no "newb" would ever take a foot in this. but then why nerf it pre-release or even after release? casual-catering #247. nobody calls me and invites me to a pro american football team cause they want to make it accessible for everyone, yeah thats really dumb isnt it?

Again, you have no frame of reference for the difficulty level which is present, and you haven't presented a factual or logical argument against their reasoning for putting Inferno on a curve instead of a flat difficulty. You could start by actually trying to refute some of the points in the big post I quoted above, of which you haven't refuted any.

Quote from Shrieker

I'm not upset, again if you can't stop bashing people personally then take it to private messages instead of the forum (or just stop). I was indeed "lied to" since the video can't reflect the difficulty anymore.

Again, you've just arbitrarily assigned some unknown values to the prior level of difficulty and the current ones, then arbitrarily decided "Oh the old values were okay, BUT NOW THIS IS TOO EASY!"

You don't have any frame of reference. It's meaningless conjecture.

Quote from Shrieker

Quote from Burzghash

You have no frame of reference for the assumptions you make above, but in case you didn't realize you were making them, I'll point them out for you:

You assume that you will no longer frequently and repeatedly die. False, in all likelihood.
You assume that this nerf will even be perceptible to you, and that you're not going to have nearly as difficult a time going through Acts 1 and 2.
You falsely assume we don't still have something to work on til the next expansion, when we still have exactly that.
You falsely assume the game wont' be crazy hard.

Again, stop making it personal.
I did assume I won't be dying as much, which is not false since they just nerfed act 1 and 2.
Yes I do assume that I will see the nerf, otherwise they would not make a post about it so no I'm not going to have as hard going through act 1 and 2 as I would without the nerf.
I do assume that we won't have as much to do until the next expansion because we're forced to do act 3 and 4 repeatedly instead of a whole difficulty.
I just said the last two acts will be as hard, so yes I am assuming that the game will be hard.

There's nothing personal about it; I'm pointing out your assumptions.

1 - You're still going to be dying plenty. If the imaginary number X you invented for the amount of times you would've died under the old difficulty makes the difference in fun for you between the new imaginary number Y you've invented for the number of times you'll die under the new difficulty, then more power to you. But realize that your reasoning isn't based on ANY form of logic or facts whatsoever, you've just arbitrarily determined in your own mind that the amount of time you spent dying under the old difficulty is always going to be better than the amount spend dying under the new difficulty. That's nothing to do with facts or reality. That's you being butthurt about a developer decision, and turning the scientific method in reverse. You've already determined the conclusion you want to come to, and now you only listen to evidence and are willing to believe things which reinforce your faulty conclusion that you're determined to come to.

2 - You're not going to see the change in difficulty, because you have no frame of comparison. You'll have absolutely zero idea how much more difficult the old difficulty in Acts 1 and 2 were before the change. And more importantly, you have absolutely zero familiarity what the overall feel of the game was prior to the implementation of scaling difficulty. As the developers already said, the game itself feels better to feel a progression of difficulty over the course of Inferno, and their logic substantiates this. If you expect to provide an argument to the contrary, you should probably try to demonstrate your point based on something factual instead of things you're not at all familiar with and being unable to address their points about player psychology and behavior.

3 - Again, you're not being forced to farm Acts 3 and 4 only. That is a restriction that you have invented in your mind that no one but you is going to force you to adhere to. So quit pretending as if everyone is being forced into this imaginary scenario that exists nowhere except your own mind. This is further substantiated by the post from the general discussion board above, which details loot overlap.

If you expect to be taken seriously further on this topic, you should at least familiarize yourself with the concept of loot overlap he describes and why you will NOT be forced to farm only Acts 3 and 4. Because at this time, you've clearly demonstrated how little grasp you have on the reality of how these changes will play out.

Quote from HDiTwiek

nerfing down act 1 + 2 results in easier acts 3 +4 since youre abled to farm really good inferno gear in act 1 or 2. the "balls-hard" difficulty for inferno goes with act 1 + 2 if you ask me.

You don't know for a fact this has actually occurred.

In addition, I love how people immediately get incensed when they so much as even get the whiff of a nerf. The worst is they get all indignant about it while simultaneously having NO context as to whether or not a nerf was warranted.

If Blizzard designs endgame scenario X, then announces they nerfed it - why would anyone get upset? You have absolutely NO context for how hard it was. What if it was overtuned and more difficult than it ever should have been? What if it was launch C'thun and mathematically impossible to do?

No, of course that doesn't factor in. People aren't smart enough to be able to think beyond, "BLIZRD Y U NERF MUH CONTENTS!? NO NERFS!!1! NURFS BAD! HURPA DURP1!1!!"

From all the posts on jay wilsons twitter about a blizzard staff 4 man group not even finishing act 1 I'm not worried about the difficulty. It's really all up to an individual perspective on what is difficult and what isn't. They can't please everyone no matter what they do but they can design a damn good game.
Im sure they have tested nightmare, hell, and inferno a lot internally with different levels of gear and what not. On this particular decision I'm trusting that they know what they're doing

Im so hyped for this game it's unreal. I looked at the calendar and found out that exams end 3 days before release. I have 3 days of preparation before Hell returns and absolutely nothing for a solid month 1/2 after release. Needless to say I'm happy as a clam.

That gif should a skill for the barbarian, you just shoot out topless bros in shopping carts.

I like the build but Barbarians have great generators i think its a bad idea to not use one. 100% dmg single attack will be the death of you. Because you want to go without an attack generator then you forced yourself to pick a run for revenge that isn't my favorite, but you have no choice you need the fury. Fury from revenge isn't reliable and you need a reliable way to get fury. Those seconds of no fury with this build will be the death of you because you are going to attack a few times with regular attack and just drop all your fury right away. You'll rarely have the opportunity to actually drop all 100 fury points into your spenders because you'll be too scared to save up fury with your weak ass single attacks. The play for this build will have you spending fury ASAP. Maybe you might save for 2 or 3 slams but in harder difficulties that normal attack might not do the job.

Gnarf mentioned to put in superstition and that is actually a must for this build with that extra fury regen.