Definitely interested in finding solid partners for hardcore. Solid meaning reasonably emotionally stable, mature, and heavily seasoned in hardcore gaming.
I think people will realize soon after release that success in Hardcore is going to be all about who you have at your side. Hit me up. I doubt you'll be able to invest more time in this game than I will
Show your support by responding to the thread in the official forums (link in OP) or creating your own threads around the community. Let's get Blizzard to recognize these ideas have incredible potential and have a community backing!
The answer is obvious. Competition. Inherent in competition is a ranking system and an enjoyable format to compete in (not necessarily perfectly "balanced"). Enter "competition modes." There's an option for literally every type of player (both PvP and PvM).
Now maybe I'm getting too far ahead of myself. The game isn't even released yet and we haven't even seen content past level 13, BUT over some time browsing forums and conversing with other players I have conglomerated some ideas that I feel would add some wonderful competitive flavor alongside (and even interacting synergistically with) the monster slaying and loot hunting that Diablo is all about.
What will you do after you've slain virtually every monster numerous times and you're in the mood to see what all that phat lewt can do?
COMPETITION MODES MY FRIENDS!
Please read through the whole list before passing judgement that I'm just a PvP fanatic. There are game modes for every type of player.
Without further ado:
1. Winner take all arenas - Items/gold put up beforehand and winning team takes all - you don't have to participate, but for those that do what a rush and motivation to win!
2. DoTA - "Defense of the Ancients" For those of you not familiar with the popular genre some quick examples to check out would be Heroes of Newerth, League of Legends, or DoTA mods in Warcraft.
In Diablo, DoTA would look very similar but, in my opinion, has the potential to be exponentially more fun due to the fact that it's YOUR character, not a character that will be gone after the game ends.
Your hero will compete alongside other heros and hordes of monsters contending with opposing heros and their hordes of monsters to accomplish objectives, kill opposing forces, or slay enemy heros.
Your team's monster's become more powerful (as do you) as these objectives are completed until the final objective (destroying the enemy base) is accomplished.
DoTA would be somewhat inherently balanced because of the fact that monsters would be equated in terms of stat distribution until objectives are accomplished and they grow stronger.
Winner takes all mode and possibly a ranking system would be great additions!
3. Content racing - Teams race through content to see who can finish first. For the PvM centered competitionist! See who can finish that boss off the quickest, who can escort that NPC faster, or who can clear an event most efficiently!
Great for making a name for your Clan or group of friends!
4. Horde Mode - Team compete to see who can hold off hoards of monsters for longer. A beautiful mix of competition and monster slaying fitting the Diablo theme perfectly!
A ranking system for who held out for how long would be a great competitive addition!
5. "Objective" Based PvP - Think capture the flag, protect the vip, hold the fortress, etc.
Great for competitive PvP that would not require razor edge balancing efforts due to the objective based play!
All formats should have competitive rankings to induce competition and most importantly A REASON TO STRIVE TO WIN!
Of course all of this is wishful thinking, but sure sounds amazing AND WOULDN'T REQUIRE E-Sports balancing or detract from the PvM side of the game in any way (it may actually compliment it! Read below!)
The possibilities for incredible game modes in Diablo 3 are very diverse and the character builds/gear setups that would arise for each game mode would be literally infinite.
This would have a wonderful indirect effect of stimulating even more trade in Diablo, thus providing an amazing synergistic effect that would be inexpressibly fun to participate in!
Furthermore these game modes would provide virtually infinite replay value to Diablo 3 and generate player motivation to continue farming/trading/PLAYING for years to come!
Great thing is my imagination sucks. I'm sure you guys can come up with even better stuff!
Honestly out of all things to be worried about, itemization is the least of my concerns... this is a beta test which is not representative of their vision.... they kept everything out of the beta for good reason, and I'm sure they've spent a lot of time looking at itemization and how it should progress. Way too early to criticize this, wait for release...
The sole reason for having a Beta is to garner input from testers and make changes to the game. What you're saying is diametrically opposed to the very purpose of a beta. Waiting for release to voice opinions and concerns is just an ignorant way to approach game design, especially when it's related to something so vital as an itemization system.
The fact is these items are probably the least interesting aspect of Diablo 3 that I've seen. Maybe we've grown too accustomed to Blizzard "breaking the mold," and that's a valid point, but we still can't help being somewhat bore-struck at basically a step BACK in itemization from Diablo 2 (D2 itemization was more thought-filled than these current listings). It just looks like laziness to me. I was expecting itemization in Diablo 3 to be just as exciting as the incredible skill system, crafting, and auction house, but it's just the same or less than past games have offered.
I completely agree if it delays the game's release. Having said that, this content has too much potential to be ignored for future development, and it can't hurt to let the developers know that there is support behind these ideas.
It would be fantastic to have a specific section to discuss aspects directly related to the Hardcore side of Diablo 3. Be ahead of the official forums on this one guys.
Before anyone morphs into captain obvious, take a second to think critically beyond your reflex reaction of "DUH 100 MORE SPIRIT BRO!"
Let's discuss current game mechanics, and the obvious up-front benefit gained by the Exalted Soul passive.
When the monk begins a game he starts with maximum spirit. Obviously, having 100 more spirit beginning each game is great. Once you use up this initial spirit, you essentially just have an additional 100 spirit gap to fill before unleashing your spirit spenders. A decent player should be able to use their spirit before "capping" the base spirit limit, thus making simply having a larger "tank" of spirit completely useless after the first couple of encounters.
Besides the obvious benefit in PvP, (starting with 100 more spirit, unleashing "burst damage" with more spirit, etc.) what benefit does this passive actually give a player in PvM setting compared to other passives? Am I completely missing something, or does this passive seem like a very inefficient way to spend on a passive ability slot?
There are a couple of questions that I would like answered regarding spirit as well that may help to shed some light on this analysis:
As I understand it, the Monk's BASE spirit is 200. Risen to 300 with Exalted Soul passive. Correct me if this is wrong, please.
Another aspect that could alter the equation would be if spirit is completely restored to maximum when "zoning in" dungeons and levels of dungeons. I could see an extra 100 spirit being slightly more desirable in this circumstance depending on how often zoning happens.
I disagree. I think competitive formats (if done correctly) would attract an overwhelmingly large amount of the player base. I think E-sports style competition is what is relegated to the more hardcore players, and that's perfectly understandable to be honest, but there is SO MUCH potential with other competitive formats. I've talked about them exhaustively in other threads, check out this link if you're interested and bump the thread.
...
How will giving players the option to participate in something that could potentially provide some enjoyment (competitive PvP, alternate gameplay modes, PvE competition formats, etc.) disadvantage anyone? Does that make any sense to anyone?
Because I (and I am not alone) would like to participate and compete at an equal level in the pvp arena using the same character I use in the game, i.e. without spending a tonne of additional time (I will already be spending a tonne of time on my game character) developing a different character that is specifically used if I want to play pvp.
I don't know what is involved in developing a pvp game that you and other disappointed gamers want, but I assume it is quite a lot, otherwise we could ALL have best of both worlds. i.e. 1/ normal game, 2/ pvp arena (using same characters as in-game), and 3/ pro-gamer arena (I think this is what you want where you have specific character builds just for pvp?)
Wait.. so you want to exclude any form of competitive PvP because YOU aren't willing to put in the effort to compete? You simply want to be able to take any character into a competitive format without any thought input into choosing abilities that would be effective against other players?
Your statements are completely contradictory. If any given player could take any given character into PvP with no thought or experience and be successful.. there would be no competition and thus the system would be meaningless by definition. Do you understand how ridiculous your statements are?
It sounds like you don't really want to participate in "competitive" PvP, and that's absolutely fine. There should also be non ranked "skirmish" scenarios that would probably be perfect for a gamer like yourself only interested in PvP for entertainment, or killing time.. I don't really understand it, but whatever. For you to suggest that the rest of us don't deserve a respectable form of competition from Diablo 3 because you don't want to compete is just ass-backwards logic.
Now maybe I'm getting too far ahead of myself. The game isn't even released yet and we haven't even seen content past level 13, BUT over some time browsing forums and conversing with other players I have conglomerated some ideas that I feel would add some wonderful competitive flavor alongside (and even synergising with) the monster slaying and loot hunting that Diablo is all about.
What will you do after you've slain virtually every monster numerous times and you're in the mood to see what all that phat lewt can do?
GAME MODES MY FRIENDS!
Please read through the whole list before passing judgement that I'm just a PvP fanatic. There are game modes for every type of player.
Without further ado:
1. Winner take all arenas - Items/gold put up beforehand and winning team takes all - you don't have to participate, but for those that do what a rush and motivation to win!
2. DoTA - "Defense of the Ancients" For those of you not familiar with the popular genre some quick examples to check out would be Heroes of Newerth, League of Legends, or DoTA mods in Warcraft.
In Diablo, DoTA would look very similar but, in my opinion, has the potential to be exponentially more fun due to the fact that it's YOUR character, not a character that will be gone after the game ends.
Your hero will compete alongside other heros and hordes of monsters contending with opposing heros and their hordes of monsters to accomplish objectives, kill opposing forces, or slay enemy heros.
Your team's monster's become more powerful (as do you) as these objectives are completed until the final objective (destroying the enemy base) is accomplished.
DoTA would be somewhat inherently balanced because of the fact that monsters would be equated in terms of stat distribution until objectives are accomplished and they grow stronger.
Winner takes all mode and possibly a ranking system would be great additions!
3. Content racing - Teams race through content to see who can finish first. For the PvM centered competitionist! See who can finish that boss off the quickest, who can escort that NPC faster, or who can clear an event most efficiently!
Great for making a name for your Clan or group of friends!
4. Horde Mode - Team compete to see who can hold off hoards of monsters for longer. A beautiful mix of competition and monster slaying fitting the Diablo theme perfectly!
A ranking system for who held out for how long would be a great competitive addition!
5. "Objective" Based PvP - Think capture the flag, protect the vip, hold the fortress, etc.
Great for competitive PvP that would not require razor edge balancing efforts due to the objective based play!
All formats should have competitive rankings to induce competition and most importantly A REASON TO STRIVE TO WIN!
Of course all of this is wishful thinking, but sure sounds amazing AND WOULDN'T REQUIRE E-Sports balancing or detract from the PvM side of the game in any way (it may actually compliment it! Read below!)
The possibilities for incredible game modes in Diablo 3 are very diverse and the character builds/gear setups that would arise for each game mode would be literally infinite.
This would have a wonderful indirect effect of stimulating even more trade in Diablo, thus providing an amazing synergistic effect that would be inexpressibly fun to participate in!
Furthermore these game modes would provide virtually infinite replaybility to Diablo 3 and generate player motivation to continue farming/trading/PLAYING for years to come!
Great thing is my imagination sucks. I'm sure you guys can come up with even better stuff!
Why not just implement the cool features because they are cool?
Boom. No one can argue with that.
This is the most basic reason why competitive formats should be introduced; because they improve the game. Not for some fear of the game becoming "E-Sports" centered, or to detract from someone's PvE experience. No. They're awesome, fun, and will provide an enormous amount of enjoyment and replay value for a wide section of the consumer base.
Although I dispute your entire premise that only the most hardcore gamers desire competition, your argument doesn't even follow a logical formula.
How will giving players the option to participate in something that could potentially provide some enjoyment (competitive PvP, alternate gameplay modes, PvE competition formats, etc.) disadvantage anyone? Does that make any sense to anyone?
There's nothing wrong with some relative imbalance. That's part of what makes PvP in gear-based games fun. "Skill" in gear-based and build oriented games isn't only relegated to "twitch" reactions, it's also based off creating unique builds and finding counters by exploiting weaknesses. It's just a different type of competition than say counterstrike or Halo. In my opinion that's what makes it so fun and it's really a shame to see the competitive potential of Diablo 3 go down the drain with the virtually infinite amount of builds and counter-builds that would arise in a competitive environment.
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I think people will realize soon after release that success in Hardcore is going to be all about who you have at your side. Hit me up. I doubt you'll be able to invest more time in this game than I will
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0
Competition Modes -
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/3182738500
Show your support by bumping!
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http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/3182738500
Now maybe I'm getting too far ahead of myself. The game isn't even released yet and we haven't even seen content past level 13, BUT over some time browsing forums and conversing with other players I have conglomerated some ideas that I feel would add some wonderful competitive flavor alongside (and even interacting synergistically with) the monster slaying and loot hunting that Diablo is all about.
What will you do after you've slain virtually every monster numerous times and you're in the mood to see what all that phat lewt can do?
COMPETITION MODES MY FRIENDS!
Please read through the whole list before passing judgement that I'm just a PvP fanatic. There are game modes for every type of player.
Without further ado:
1. Winner take all arenas - Items/gold put up beforehand and winning team takes all - you don't have to participate, but for those that do what a rush and motivation to win!
2. DoTA - "Defense of the Ancients" For those of you not familiar with the popular genre some quick examples to check out would be Heroes of Newerth, League of Legends, or DoTA mods in Warcraft.
In Diablo, DoTA would look very similar but, in my opinion, has the potential to be exponentially more fun due to the fact that it's YOUR character, not a character that will be gone after the game ends.
Your hero will compete alongside other heros and hordes of monsters contending with opposing heros and their hordes of monsters to accomplish objectives, kill opposing forces, or slay enemy heros.
Your team's monster's become more powerful (as do you) as these objectives are completed until the final objective (destroying the enemy base) is accomplished.
DoTA would be somewhat inherently balanced because of the fact that monsters would be equated in terms of stat distribution until objectives are accomplished and they grow stronger.
Winner takes all mode and possibly a ranking system would be great additions!
3. Content racing - Teams race through content to see who can finish first. For the PvM centered competitionist! See who can finish that boss off the quickest, who can escort that NPC faster, or who can clear an event most efficiently!
Great for making a name for your Clan or group of friends!
4. Horde Mode - Team compete to see who can hold off hoards of monsters for longer. A beautiful mix of competition and monster slaying fitting the Diablo theme perfectly!
A ranking system for who held out for how long would be a great competitive addition!
5. "Objective" Based PvP - Think capture the flag, protect the vip, hold the fortress, etc.
Great for competitive PvP that would not require razor edge balancing efforts due to the objective based play!
All formats should have competitive rankings to induce competition and most importantly A REASON TO STRIVE TO WIN!
Of course all of this is wishful thinking, but sure sounds amazing AND WOULDN'T REQUIRE E-Sports balancing or detract from the PvM side of the game in any way (it may actually compliment it! Read below!)
The possibilities for incredible game modes in Diablo 3 are very diverse and the character builds/gear setups that would arise for each game mode would be literally infinite.
This would have a wonderful indirect effect of stimulating even more trade in Diablo, thus providing an amazing synergistic effect that would be inexpressibly fun to participate in!
Furthermore these game modes would provide virtually infinite replay value to Diablo 3 and generate player motivation to continue farming/trading/PLAYING for years to come!
Great thing is my imagination sucks. I'm sure you guys can come up with even better stuff!
1
The sole reason for having a Beta is to garner input from testers and make changes to the game. What you're saying is diametrically opposed to the very purpose of a beta. Waiting for release to voice opinions and concerns is just an ignorant way to approach game design, especially when it's related to something so vital as an itemization system.
The fact is these items are probably the least interesting aspect of Diablo 3 that I've seen. Maybe we've grown too accustomed to Blizzard "breaking the mold," and that's a valid point, but we still can't help being somewhat bore-struck at basically a step BACK in itemization from Diablo 2 (D2 itemization was more thought-filled than these current listings). It just looks like laziness to me. I was expecting itemization in Diablo 3 to be just as exciting as the incredible skill system, crafting, and auction house, but it's just the same or less than past games have offered.
Not impressed.
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0
Thanks!
0
Before anyone morphs into captain obvious, take a second to think critically beyond your reflex reaction of "DUH 100 MORE SPIRIT BRO!"
Let's discuss current game mechanics, and the obvious up-front benefit gained by the Exalted Soul passive.
When the monk begins a game he starts with maximum spirit. Obviously, having 100 more spirit beginning each game is great. Once you use up this initial spirit, you essentially just have an additional 100 spirit gap to fill before unleashing your spirit spenders. A decent player should be able to use their spirit before "capping" the base spirit limit, thus making simply having a larger "tank" of spirit completely useless after the first couple of encounters.
Besides the obvious benefit in PvP, (starting with 100 more spirit, unleashing "burst damage" with more spirit, etc.) what benefit does this passive actually give a player in PvM setting compared to other passives? Am I completely missing something, or does this passive seem like a very inefficient way to spend on a passive ability slot?
There are a couple of questions that I would like answered regarding spirit as well that may help to shed some light on this analysis:
As I understand it, the Monk's BASE spirit is 200. Risen to 300 with Exalted Soul passive. Correct me if this is wrong, please.
Another aspect that could alter the equation would be if spirit is completely restored to maximum when "zoning in" dungeons and levels of dungeons. I could see an extra 100 spirit being slightly more desirable in this circumstance depending on how often zoning happens.
Thoughts?
0
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/3182738500
0
Wait.. so you want to exclude any form of competitive PvP because YOU aren't willing to put in the effort to compete? You simply want to be able to take any character into a competitive format without any thought input into choosing abilities that would be effective against other players?
Your statements are completely contradictory. If any given player could take any given character into PvP with no thought or experience and be successful.. there would be no competition and thus the system would be meaningless by definition. Do you understand how ridiculous your statements are?
It sounds like you don't really want to participate in "competitive" PvP, and that's absolutely fine. There should also be non ranked "skirmish" scenarios that would probably be perfect for a gamer like yourself only interested in PvP for entertainment, or killing time.. I don't really understand it, but whatever. For you to suggest that the rest of us don't deserve a respectable form of competition from Diablo 3 because you don't want to compete is just ass-backwards logic.
0
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/3182738500
0
Boom. No one can argue with that.
This is the most basic reason why competitive formats should be introduced; because they improve the game. Not for some fear of the game becoming "E-Sports" centered, or to detract from someone's PvE experience. No. They're awesome, fun, and will provide an enormous amount of enjoyment and replay value for a wide section of the consumer base.
0
0
How will giving players the option to participate in something that could potentially provide some enjoyment (competitive PvP, alternate gameplay modes, PvE competition formats, etc.) disadvantage anyone? Does that make any sense to anyone?
0