1. Alabaster run + fan of knives. Is it a one shot deal or will it proc each and everytime you get hit during that 20 seconds?
2. Shadow Power + blood moon may be OP if the atk spd. of melee atks are adequately increased. (Rough theoretical damage at 666% wp per second x 45% healing conversion for a min of 300% healing, with spike trap bursts jumping it to 1100% damage and 495% healing.
3. Anybody make a cost comparison between Custom Engineering vs. Perfectionist yet? Depending on the play-style, you could argue that sentry / caltrops are now being cast at 50% their original cost.
As well, the passive thrill of the hunt may be slightly beneficial in this build. (though I likely wouldn't take it.
Slight difference where you are basically circling around the mob with shadow power and caltrops, and a change for sentry so that you don't have to maneuver quite so much.
Dammit. I really hope the complaints were really valid. It makes me almost not want to play a DH anymore... (imho it sounded more like they needed to tweak the cost a little bit. Now you can predict which skills a DH will use.)
sigh... if you are looking at hitting 20 different targets then it is 20 x140% over 20 targets for... surprise, surprise... a stunning single-target shot of 140% percent.
multishot begins at 110% damage unruned. Give it the damage modifier and it's at 242%
Besides, this doesn't matter anymore... they apparently already updated the new demon hunter skills.
New stats for HA is 115% with a 60% chance to pierce targets when unruned and now generates 5 hatred.
Also, I don't think you can double-rune abilities?
Max HG damage bonus from passives and MfD would be 80%, and since you aren't double-runed you only get a 60% piecing option, which should technically fizzle out piercings alot faster then you'd expect.
80 + 140 + (140xP-1) Assuming 3 piercings with a likely fail rate at 5, your last randomly hit monster will only yield:
500-780% damage on the last mob hit.
The magic bonus bit is somewhat interesting. It will likely be calculated as "if you do 75 weapon damage, add another 75 weapon damage to the total damage amount." and will most likely only stack after the other calculations are done.
Now, the reduced returns effect changes HG quite a bit. Taking the 5 shots, your values add in at 220 + 360 + 560 + 640 + 780 per pierce.
Compare this to multishot: 550 + 550 + 550 + 550 + 550.
HG: 1140-2560
MS: 2750
Then we can add the magic damage bonus... assuming a 75 damage bow.
HG: 75x5(shots) = 375 damage
MS: 75x5(mobs)x5(shots)= 1875 damage(?)
Adding in an actual rune for multishot.. the values change quite a bit. Crimson rune switches MS from 2750 to 6050.
This of course is assuming things don't die so easily end game.
Edited: Made a mistake in the math. Besides.. this only works with multiple targets. This is a single target damage thread...
There are a couple of low cost abilities that you can stack.
The problem is that you are assuming that runed effects take effect prior to passive effects.
The 15 might happen first, which means that having both of them attached only saves 2.5 hate compared to just having the passive.
imho, grenades at the moment suck. They start off with less damage then chakram and then the only ability that adds a real benefit to anything is the stun grenade. Even poison only maxes out as an un-runed grenade iff the mob stands still in the poison.
It's not a super-awesome build. It's mostly based on getting rid of hatred and jumping away so that you can proc fundamentals once, while gaining time when your going against melee classes.
Entangling shot ->Bola-> strafe to 0 hate then vault for a quick jump back, and hopefully the fundamentals will kick in at least once. Then Chakrum/caltrops and another basic shot.
It's my secret build. DH skills are uniquely runed such that you can occasionally add two distinctly different ability types... Like fan of blades for instance. Depending on the rune, you end up with either a melee physical counter, a ranged counter, or a stun. The other options increase a specific effect that that skill already has. (in this case, only 2(?) runes offers a two separate abilities for one cast.)
Switching the same subbed ability from previously; I can use Impale + Obsidian rune for more damage, or indigo rune if you choose not to use vault.
Strill: there are some abilities that use 35 hate per cast. Even the build I'm looking at will likely require me to sub out an ability or two when I need a proper aoe sequence. The 3-shot combo plan uses a ton of hate all at once too, so i'll likely be adding entangling shot + golden. (multi-shot most likely.) You will also need to test which skill to cast first. Some of the prep abilities cost a fair bit of resource. Since Discipline is a slow regen, you may end up needing/wanting to cast that one first so that you can make benefit of more time to regen that blue fluid bar.
Most of the builds I'll be working with use 5 abilities so that I can swap out if I need a different ability for a second.
Questions should be asked for macros. (I'll be picking up a new razr mouse when the game comes out. 4-button is not enough imho.)
People also need to consider the single target spammable entangling shot with Golden rune for 1 hate in lieu of excess hate regeneration. Sure, it's a pitiful 135% weapon damage, but it is 1 hate. (with a slow included.)
The thing about Demonhunter is that with 3 abilites, you can deal 1285% weapon damage to a single target which also includes a slow and an aoe. Depending on the exact mechanics, you can sub a single ability out and yield 2735% weapon damage, single target. Multiple opponents in this case drops single target dps a bit.
And this is without passive abilities or companion. No Marked for death either.
At level 24.
PantheraOnca:
It's extremely hard to define how a fundamentals build will be if we don't know what a basic attack is... For all we know, it could be the damage modifier for any skill that is not added from a rune.
I question the change in wording from the original guessed at that we used. If we look at a runed effect system; some abilities have the original bonus + ability bonus. In this case then fundamentals would only double one side of the damage equation. Using Entangling shot + obsidian rune - this means fundamentals change the value from 130%wd + 64 to 260%wd + 64. For some runed abilities, this results in reduced returns when compared to how other abilities may stack.
All it really does is it modifies the burst/sustained damage ratios a bit. Basically instead of having a data-map which shows a damage meter that runs a standard wave output for bursty-white damage; you end up with a more rounded map. Less burst damage over each 12 second cycle for a sustained output damage. (you still run out of hate at about... 56 seconds using a 4 burst+ 1 basic cycle, if you are doing an ability every 0.8 seconds. I'm currently basing it on a 0.8 second cast with the inclusion of 1 regen tick.)
It has the negative impact for non-boss fights. Basically for any fight that will last longer then 11 casts, you sacrifice some other ability that will increase damage output.
If you aren't a strategist; this is your skill. If you are, then dump it.
If you combine this with archery... then maybe. dual-bow increase critical hit; which in turn may make the numbers sweeter for your min values mid-game. End game? It probably remains a little bit low on account that you are looking for stats end game. A 50 damage bow will only yield a static 50 damage bonus end game wheras a 20% ATK(?) modifier will scale damage drastically when you are dealing with values in the 100's.
If a skill does 200% weapon damage then at end game, your modifier for a burst will only be 200 damage per shot with fundamentals.
Now... there is a question concerning wording. Thrill of the Hunt vs. Fundamentals. To me, there still seems to be some issues with typos and wordings and what-not. What constitutes a basic attack?
*shrugs* In some ways I do think the color is problematic... I mean if you don't know the character well enough that you have to look to begin with, then you need to find a new class to play....
Glancing for health well... if you're a Barb, that's all-right.
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2. Shadow Power + blood moon may be OP if the atk spd. of melee atks are adequately increased. (Rough theoretical damage at 666% wp per second x 45% healing conversion for a min of 300% healing, with spike trap bursts jumping it to 1100% damage and 495% healing.
3. Anybody make a cost comparison between Custom Engineering vs. Perfectionist yet? Depending on the play-style, you could argue that sentry / caltrops are now being cast at 50% their original cost.
As well, the passive thrill of the hunt may be slightly beneficial in this build. (though I likely wouldn't take it.
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/demon-hunter#WghjZU!cXV!aabaZa
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Slight difference where you are basically circling around the mob with shadow power and caltrops, and a change for sentry so that you don't have to maneuver quite so much.
0
Except grenades, they became sort of useful again.
0
0
0
multishot begins at 110% damage unruned. Give it the damage modifier and it's at 242%
Besides, this doesn't matter anymore... they apparently already updated the new demon hunter skills.
New stats for HA is 115% with a 60% chance to pierce targets when unruned and now generates 5 hatred.
0
0
HG is not a rocket.
Also, I don't think you can double-rune abilities?
Max HG damage bonus from passives and MfD would be 80%, and since you aren't double-runed you only get a 60% piecing option, which should technically fizzle out piercings alot faster then you'd expect.
80 + 140 + (140xP-1) Assuming 3 piercings with a likely fail rate at 5, your last randomly hit monster will only yield:
500-780% damage on the last mob hit.
The magic bonus bit is somewhat interesting. It will likely be calculated as "if you do 75 weapon damage, add another 75 weapon damage to the total damage amount." and will most likely only stack after the other calculations are done.
Now, the reduced returns effect changes HG quite a bit. Taking the 5 shots, your values add in at 220 + 360 + 560 + 640 + 780 per pierce.
Compare this to multishot: 550 + 550 + 550 + 550 + 550.
HG: 1140-2560
MS: 2750
Then we can add the magic damage bonus... assuming a 75 damage bow.
HG: 75x5(shots) = 375 damage
MS: 75x5(mobs)x5(shots)= 1875 damage(?)
Adding in an actual rune for multishot.. the values change quite a bit. Crimson rune switches MS from 2750 to 6050.
This of course is assuming things don't die so easily end game.
Edited: Made a mistake in the math.
0
The problem is that you are assuming that runed effects take effect prior to passive effects.
The 15 might happen first, which means that having both of them attached only saves 2.5 hate compared to just having the passive.
imho, grenades at the moment suck. They start off with less damage then chakram and then the only ability that adds a real benefit to anything is the stun grenade. Even poison only maxes out as an un-runed grenade iff the mob stands still in the poison.
0
multi-shot shadow power regen tank build.
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0
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/demon-hunter#bXPVda!XWc!YaYacc
Entangling shot ->Bola-> strafe to 0 hate then vault for a quick jump back, and hopefully the fundamentals will kick in at least once. Then Chakrum/caltrops and another basic shot.
0
Switching the same subbed ability from previously; I can use Impale + Obsidian rune for more damage, or indigo rune if you choose not to use vault.
Strill: there are some abilities that use 35 hate per cast. Even the build I'm looking at will likely require me to sub out an ability or two when I need a proper aoe sequence. The 3-shot combo plan uses a ton of hate all at once too, so i'll likely be adding entangling shot + golden. (multi-shot most likely.) You will also need to test which skill to cast first. Some of the prep abilities cost a fair bit of resource. Since Discipline is a slow regen, you may end up needing/wanting to cast that one first so that you can make benefit of more time to regen that blue fluid bar.
Most of the builds I'll be working with use 5 abilities so that I can swap out if I need a different ability for a second.
Questions should be asked for macros. (I'll be picking up a new razr mouse when the game comes out. 4-button is not enough imho.)
0
People also need to consider the single target spammable entangling shot with Golden rune for 1 hate in lieu of excess hate regeneration. Sure, it's a pitiful 135% weapon damage, but it is 1 hate. (with a slow included.)
The thing about Demonhunter is that with 3 abilites, you can deal 1285% weapon damage to a single target which also includes a slow and an aoe. Depending on the exact mechanics, you can sub a single ability out and yield 2735% weapon damage, single target. Multiple opponents in this case drops single target dps a bit.
And this is without passive abilities or companion. No Marked for death either.
At level 24.
PantheraOnca:
It's extremely hard to define how a fundamentals build will be if we don't know what a basic attack is... For all we know, it could be the damage modifier for any skill that is not added from a rune.
I question the change in wording from the original guessed at that we used. If we look at a runed effect system; some abilities have the original bonus + ability bonus. In this case then fundamentals would only double one side of the damage equation. Using Entangling shot + obsidian rune - this means fundamentals change the value from 130%wd + 64 to 260%wd + 64. For some runed abilities, this results in reduced returns when compared to how other abilities may stack.
0
It has the negative impact for non-boss fights. Basically for any fight that will last longer then 11 casts, you sacrifice some other ability that will increase damage output.
If you aren't a strategist; this is your skill. If you are, then dump it.
If you combine this with archery... then maybe. dual-bow increase critical hit; which in turn may make the numbers sweeter for your min values mid-game. End game? It probably remains a little bit low on account that you are looking for stats end game. A 50 damage bow will only yield a static 50 damage bonus end game wheras a 20% ATK(?) modifier will scale damage drastically when you are dealing with values in the 100's.
If a skill does 200% weapon damage then at end game, your modifier for a burst will only be 200 damage per shot with fundamentals.
Now... there is a question concerning wording. Thrill of the Hunt vs. Fundamentals. To me, there still seems to be some issues with typos and wordings and what-not. What constitutes a basic attack?