Ok so I took a common sense approach because the numbers being posted a quite rediculous without some kind of real-world assumptions and restrictions being placed on them.
I have limited my calculations to "sensible" builds.
For the barbarian we have:
20,160,000,000 total barbarian combinations, with my given restrictions.
You guys can work out the rest!
Snipped the quote a bit, but thank you for understanding my point sir, you win the thread cookie. There may be wiggle room beyond what would normally be considered sensible, as odd combinations can sometimes provide utility beyond the obvious, but I like the idea you've taken here :D.
For proper theory crafting to occur, you should disregard the differences between the large majority of the possible builds as an overwhelming percent of those possible will be far from optimal just for the fact that they're being thrown together randomly and examined, and then meaningless to the fact that the skills may NOT be useful together, you're suggesting that same build should be considerd again with a different rune in x skill.
No, for proper theory crafting to occur one must logically take the first steps and hypothosise which skills could or should work together and compare from there, making only the changes the make sense, thus substantially limiting the number of possible comparisons needed/wasted. This would get the amount of time spent down to a reasonable value and thus allow people to play in this century.
Look, again I'm not arguing that the numbers are wrong, or whatever the case, but can you possibly tell me how the knowledge that there are 1.8 trillion builds or if I were to tell you there were 1.8 quadrillion builds would have any real affect on what you did to come up with a build?
There is a difference here. My numbers are not an estimate, they're correct. The OP is bullshit. Your point is completely meaningless in a world of easily swappable skills.
The important point being made here is that there are a significant number of builds to try in the game, and that it's non-trivial to determine the build to use. Compare to d2 where there were significantly *more* builds, but it was obvious what the best were, and your point wasn't meaningless because you *did* need to re-roll for *every minor difference.*
Correct or not isn't really the point. You're saying theres 1.8 tril, hes saying a metric butt ton more. The applied difference to any logical argument concerning the game is.... Nothing. It wouldn't affect the discussion wether it was half as much, or that number to the nth degree. I just don't undestand arguing of the specifics of the number of possible builds. THAT is very trivial, especially as the number of possible builds has nothing to do with determining "the build to use". Does knowing how many houses there are for sale on the entire planet help me to determine which one to buy? Not in any way, wether it was 1.8 trillion houses, or however many quadrillion houses, the house I buy is not affected in any way by this knowledge, and there is no practical use provided by knowing the answer.
The only possible way it would truly affect me would be if I was going to examine all the possibilities. When there are that many possibilities, ( in either case, well beyond the realm of possibility for anyone to acknowledge and check all of them ), it is quite clear no one will be doing such a thing.
Incase it seems necessary for me to defend that point as well, if you were able to look at, and consider every one of those possible builds in a single second, and the next in the next second, with no down time between, so one per second, for consecutive seconds.... you would spend the next 57,843.49 years going over the possible builds.
If it offended you that I called your math an estimate then sure, I'm sorry. I couldn't be bothered to work up the math myself, and so I wasn't going to confirm or deny either conclusion. To add to the silliness of calculating an exact number at such an extreme, if any skill is removed and not replace, or one added and not removed, it will invalidate all previous absolutely correct large numbers.
So... To state the point I originally made, which was apparently dismissed, for what reason I don't know...
The number of builds is sufficiently large for any discussion of diversity or any such topic as it could possibly apply to any aspect of the game.
Theory crafting should be used to figure out mathematical problems and possibilities that actually have some applicable use...
Soooo, I was reading this, and your numbers are rather unimportant. Disregarding the reason for posting them, lets assume this game is rediculously successful beyond their wildest dreams, and reaches the 50 million sales mark. If there is even 1 billion combinations, which even the lower estimate suggested above says every class will have much more than that each, then to reach even that 1 billion combinations each of those 50,000,000 players would have to create 20 completely unique characters, not one of them being alike, and ofcourse to have them all unique all 20 of each of their characters would have to max out in level.
Thats for 1,000,000 combinations.
It's safe to assume that there is technically more than that.
Is there a need to bicker over the specifics of how many billions/trillions/quadrillions there might be? It seems that any arguement can be made by assuming the number of combinations is sufficiently large, no?
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Snipped the quote a bit, but thank you for understanding my point sir, you win the thread cookie. There may be wiggle room beyond what would normally be considered sensible, as odd combinations can sometimes provide utility beyond the obvious, but I like the idea you've taken here :D.
No, for proper theory crafting to occur one must logically take the first steps and hypothosise which skills could or should work together and compare from there, making only the changes the make sense, thus substantially limiting the number of possible comparisons needed/wasted. This would get the amount of time spent down to a reasonable value and thus allow people to play in this century.
Look, again I'm not arguing that the numbers are wrong, or whatever the case, but can you possibly tell me how the knowledge that there are 1.8 trillion builds or if I were to tell you there were 1.8 quadrillion builds would have any real affect on what you did to come up with a build?
Correct or not isn't really the point. You're saying theres 1.8 tril, hes saying a metric butt ton more. The applied difference to any logical argument concerning the game is.... Nothing. It wouldn't affect the discussion wether it was half as much, or that number to the nth degree. I just don't undestand arguing of the specifics of the number of possible builds. THAT is very trivial, especially as the number of possible builds has nothing to do with determining "the build to use". Does knowing how many houses there are for sale on the entire planet help me to determine which one to buy? Not in any way, wether it was 1.8 trillion houses, or however many quadrillion houses, the house I buy is not affected in any way by this knowledge, and there is no practical use provided by knowing the answer.
The only possible way it would truly affect me would be if I was going to examine all the possibilities. When there are that many possibilities, ( in either case, well beyond the realm of possibility for anyone to acknowledge and check all of them ), it is quite clear no one will be doing such a thing.
Incase it seems necessary for me to defend that point as well, if you were able to look at, and consider every one of those possible builds in a single second, and the next in the next second, with no down time between, so one per second, for consecutive seconds.... you would spend the next 57,843.49 years going over the possible builds.
If it offended you that I called your math an estimate then sure, I'm sorry. I couldn't be bothered to work up the math myself, and so I wasn't going to confirm or deny either conclusion. To add to the silliness of calculating an exact number at such an extreme, if any skill is removed and not replace, or one added and not removed, it will invalidate all previous absolutely correct large numbers.
So... To state the point I originally made, which was apparently dismissed, for what reason I don't know...
The number of builds is sufficiently large for any discussion of diversity or any such topic as it could possibly apply to any aspect of the game.
Theory crafting should be used to figure out mathematical problems and possibilities that actually have some applicable use...
USE YOUR POWERS FOR GOOD!
Thats for 1,000,000 combinations.
It's safe to assume that there is technically more than that.
Is there a need to bicker over the specifics of how many billions/trillions/quadrillions there might be? It seems that any arguement can be made by assuming the number of combinations is sufficiently large, no?