How many people want Diablo to be an eSports? I know I would, it would give Diablo pvp a whole new meaning. I think it would work great and get better the more blizzard works with it. You can compare it to wow pvp (I'd rather not lol) Diablo has Line of Sight, Cool-downs, Crowd Controls, Buffs, different builds for variety and does take teamwork and skill to win. Diablo 3 has already become way more complex than click-to-smash like in Diablo 2 (don't get me wrong I love Diablo 2). They could incorporate multiple pvp version like TDM, LMS, CTF or whatever the players want.
I was lucky enough to go to last years Blizzcon and exsperiance the Diablo 3 pvp multiple times. All the classes were very balanced there was no annoying healer like in wow and it was a whole lot more fun than wow. They could also incorporate an arena system and have the finals at Blizzcon every year. Sense they don't do Warcraft tournaments there is a spot open. If started early the eSports would last a long time since there is going to be 2 or 3 exspansions with the game.
I know the said they wouldn't do it but they also said that if there was enough of us who wants Diablo 3 to be an eSport they would do it. So who wants a more competitive pvp?
I don't believe they've ever said that if there are enough PvP focused players they would make it eSport viable. Quite the opposite actually, they have said they will NEVER focus the game towards eSports. People need to realize that the Diablo series is a 'single player online game that can be played with friends'. The whole goal of the game's design is focused around this design.
Casual PvP will exist in the form of Arena, but abilities and such will not be heavily balanced (think how easy it'd be to kill melee chars with jumping spiders). In order to actually balance the game around PvP, they would have to either tune abilities separate for PvP and PvE (sometimes completely altering an ability), or just tune the game completely around PvP. Neither of these are good options for anywhere in the near future as they infringe on the whole point of the game, PvE.
You may think that tuning separately would allow PvP without affecting PvE but you'd be wrong. Development resources that could be used to add additional PvE content and fixes would instead be focused on tuning every possible combination of ability to make sure it is balanced when fighting players. Its not a small feat at all. In fact, with the amount of combinations of abilities you can have in Diablo 3 with elective mode, actually maintaining eSport balance might be impossible even.
Diablo 3 is just not the game for eSport PvP. Not every game needs to be made into an eSport and I'm quite tired of people thinking they do. Diablo 3 will be an amazingly fun game that will be played for years to come, without eSport balance. If you're only looking for eSport PvP...play a different game.
First of all don't tell me what I did or did not hear. I heard them say it live at last years Blizzcon in front of 26000 people, that they would support it if enough people backed it. Secondly I am not saying I don't like PvE. On the contrary I can't wait for the boss battles and the story line to unfold. But you can only learn something once. Also PvP would only support PvE because you are going to have to spend a lot of time farming for better gear to be the better player, wich seems fair to me. They already have a program called "Snow" wich allows them to change things like damage, cool-downs, stun effects and other stuff for PvP that would not affect PvE. Now they have even more to to perfect the PvP. And nobody has any evidence that PvP will harm PvE and the fact that they can't change the skills for PvP because it is "confusing to the players" is a bunch of crap. Jay Willson may not want it to be an eSports but the players do.
Sorry I did not read the posts before this one, for I am only taking a break from homework.. So my quick opinion is..
No I do not want to play D3 Esports but I would gladly participate if it did. Although I love Esports... Starting in Tribes2 TWL, Counter-Strike CAL, Starcraft and SC2, it makes the games competitively strenuous yet so rewarding. I am close friends with those nerds I teamed up with and we continue to have great times of reflection of those days, but my scapegoat from that scene was Diablo. It was pure enjoyment. Casual. Put your feet up, click and have a sandvich kinda game. Thats exactly what Blizz intended
If the PvP takes over all other factions of the game, it wouldn't be DIABLO 3. Im sure many of you already stated things about balance issues, huge variables, little skill involved, blah blah, basically it won't be an Esport.. If the community invents their own support for it, it will only be that.
First of all don't tell me what I did or did not hear. I heard them say it live at last years Blizzcon in front of 26000 people, that they would support it if enough people backed it. Secondly I am not saying I don't like PvE. On the contrary I can't wait for the boss battles and the story line to unfold. But you can only learn something once. Also PvP would only support PvE because you are going to have to spend a lot of time farming for better gear to be the better player, wich seems fair to me. They already have a program called "Snow" wich allows them to change things like damage, cool-downs, stun effects and other stuff for PvP that would not affect PvE. Now they have even more to to perfect the PvP. And nobody has any evidence that PvP will harm PvE and the fact that they can't change the skills for PvP because it is "confusing to the players" is a bunch of crap. Jay Willson may not want it to be an eSports but the players do.
They pretty much specifically state that they will not do ANYTHING that points the game towards an eSport. They know that people want an eSport out of Diablo 3, but they aren't going to do it. I need to ask if you've actually done any game development? Because its not like Blizzard has infinite time and resources to dump into PvP/PvE. No, the more they focus development on PvP the less time and resources they have for PvE. Having played Diablo 3 as all the classes, just in the first 13 levels you have enough choices that eSport level PvP would actually be quite hard to balance. Scale that up to level 60 and the full array of skills, runes, items, etc that you have access to, and eSport level balance would be nearly impossible (a nightmare to do at least).
So, no... what Jay has stated is not crap. The reasons he gave for the direction they are going make a whole lot of sense. Could they have made Diablo 3 a PvP focused game, sure....but they didn't. They chose to focus on their story and PvE and give PvP the back seat. The entire game was designed around this and at this point its not likely to change...ever. If you want eSport PvP look elsewhere.
THE GAME IS ALREADY PRIMED AND SET FOR PVP. We have seen the youtube videos of it and me and hundres of others played it first hand. Even though the skill system has change they still do all the same things you just don't have to farm for runes (which gets rid of more variables). Skills are also limited by the number of slots (6) there are, as for WoW (which is a successful eSport) you can use all of them (even if they are not feasible, which will apply to Diablo too, they won't use skills that are not useful for PvP). As for the gear I think that if you spend more time getting better gear then you should be the better player. AND YOU are not even paying any attention to what I am saying or bringing forth any new evidence that would counter me. As for Jay, I was saying that they can change affects inside the pvp but won't because it would "confuse us" is crap, not his ideas on it. It is also stated (by the release date) that the PvE is finished and will only be adjusted by patches until the next expansion comes out.
If your a game developer, then tell me what is it that they can't do? What is it that the developers haven't done yet in the years they spent making this game? Tell me exactly why it would not make a good eSports. If you can't then don't presume to dictact how the game will fold out. All I am saying is that they should at least try and if it utterly fails then fine at least they tried.
THE GAME IS ALREADY PRIMED AND SET FOR PVP. We have seen the youtube videos of it and me and hundres of others played it first hand. Even though the skill system has change they still do all the same things you just don't have to farm for runes (which gets rid of more variables). Skills are also limited by the number of slots (6) there are, as for WoW (which is a successful eSport) you can use all of them (even if they are not feasible, which will apply to Diablo too, they won't use skills that are not useful for PvP). As for the gear I think that if you spend more time getting better gear then you should be the better player. AND YOU are not even paying any attention to what I am saying or bringing forth any new evidence that would counter me. As for Jay, I was saying that they can change affects inside the pvp but won't because it would "confuse us" is crap, not his ideas on it. It is also stated (by the release date) that the PvE is finished and will only be adjusted by patches until the next expansion comes out.
If your a game developer, then tell me what is it that they can't do? What is it that the developers haven't done yet in the years they spent making this game? Tell me exactly why it would not make a good eSports. If you can't then don't presume to dictact how the game will fold out. All I am saying is that they should at least try and if it utterly fails then fine at least they tried.
Sinceraly your devoted diablo fan.
What the developers cannot do is reasonably balance the combinations of skills they way they currently exist. The shear amount of combinations would essentially require a team specifically dedicated to PvP balance and design. As for what they haven't done, I'm sure the matchmaking system isn't complete, the skills aren't designed in a PvP friendly way, the items aren't designed in a PvP friendly way, the new arena system doesn't seem to be complete as they changed the design for PvP from back at Blizzcon and likely haven't made it the focus. PvP has likely always been last on the development list for Diablo 3 and as such it just isn't even ready for casual arena PvP.
Diablo 3 'could' make a good eSport if it was designed differently. However, the game isn't designed around PvP. Many of the abilities are designed around killing groups of monsters and balanced as such. Creating separate abilities for PvP and PvE will create a void between players as many wouldn't like the alterations to their abilities.
I've also heard nothing that says we won't get PvE content during patches. What I did hear that the current shape of the game will be what we have for launch. That doesn't mean that new content (aka new quests, events, etc) won't be added during a patch.
Face the music man, Diablo 3 isn't designed for competitive PvP. Skills focused around PvE, the RMAH, casual PvP arena, and a specific statement from Jay Wilson stating they will not add any features focusing towards eSports. How can you possibly think Diablo 3 should go eSport PvP? It hasn't been designed at all that way and you want them to essentially alter everything to cater to a minor chunk of their userbase? It is just not likely to happen, at all.
Now you are sounding a lot better, you are not so absulutist and you are giving me some constructive critism. You still don't listen though. They dont have to change much of anything at all. They do have a team just for PvP. They can change the effects of skills in PvP without harming the PvE aspect of the game they just choose not too. I will go through your list of resons and counter them.
First skill are limited by how many you can use at a time and by how viable they will be in the arenas which reduces the variables. Over powered skills can be adjusted inside the arenas. Skills that are good for PvP will be used in the arenas and skills good for PvE will be used to kill monsters.
Second the variables in gear does not affect it at all. People will just use the best gear for PvP for PvP and the same for PvE. You will just have to play PvE more to get better gear. They could even have set gear for PvP like WoW or the demos if they wanted too.
Third even if the matchmaking system and the arenas are not finished they will be. This has no effect whether or not it will be an eSport.
Fourth there have been other games that weren't designed PvP but turned out to be great eSports games and Diablo 3 could be one of them.
Fifth the RMAH also does not affect it. If people want to pay to get gear it affects PvP no more than it does PvE or people who want to get the gear themselves.
Everyone love PvP and will keep Diablo 3 running for a long time. Trust me I hear the music, it just means something different to me.
Now you are sounding a lot better, you are not so absulutist and you are giving me some constructive critism. You still don't listen though. They dont have to change much of anything at all. They do have a team just for PvP. They can change the effects of skills in PvP without harming the PvE aspect of the game they just choose not too. I will go through your list of resons and counter them.
First skill are limited by how many you can use at a time and by how viable they will be in the arenas which reduces the variables. Over powered skills can be adjusted inside the arenas. Skills that are good for PvP will be used in the arenas and skills good for PvE will be used to kill monsters.
Second the variables in gear does not affect it at all. People will just use the best gear for PvP for PvP and the same for PvE. You will just have to play PvE more to get better gear. They could even have set gear for PvP like WoW or the demos if they wanted too.
Third even if the matchmaking system and the arenas are not finished they will be. This has no effect whether or not it will be an eSport.
Fourth there have been other games that weren't designed PvP but turned out to be great eSports games and Diablo 3 could be one of them.
Fifth the RMAH also does not affect it. If people want to pay to get gear it affects PvP no more than it does PvE or people who want to get the gear themselves.
Everyone love PvP and will keep Diablo 3 running for a long time. Trust me I hear the music, it just means something different to me.
Honestly, what you seem to be asking for is exactly what we're getting...casual PvP. eSport PvP balance is quite a different monster then balancing crowd control and damage slightly. In order to make Diablo 3 a eSport, you'd need rankings, clans, duels, spectator mode, altered abilities for eSport (aka things like corpse spiders would need to be reworked heavily), etc. Its no simple matter, it essentially will require most of the skills, runes, items, gems, etc to be reworked with PvP in mind. It is a vast amount of development that would have to be shifted from other areas of the game.
To comment on the RMAH issue, no good tournament will likely accept Diablo 3 as an eSport if players can just buy power. Since items vastly alter your power, being able to purchase said power will heavily sway matches and make it hard to have fair tournaments. Force Gaming talked about this as well, stating that in order for Diablo 3 to really be an eSport, the auction houses need to be disabled. Since the auction house systems are the funding for further Diablo development, I don't think anyone wants that.
PvP will be in the game. Some people may attempt to make it an eSport, but Blizzard won't assist in that. Its not the direction they want to go with the game and not the direction the majority of their players want either. I will enjoy the PvP that they do offer, but don't want to see them sacrifice development on other areas of the game just to suit a minority.
Thank you finally someone has given me something solid and concrete. That only means though that it won't be able to support it in the beginning but can still come in later, in patches or expansions. The eSports would have to just be Hardcore players only, which is a given. There is a chance that it can be an eSport and you all know it and that's what I'm shooting for.
Thank you finally someone has given me something solid and concrete. That only means though that it won't be able to support it in the beginning but can still come in later, in patches or expansions. The eSports would have to just be Hardcore players only, which is a given. There is a chance that it can be an eSport and you all know it and that's what I'm shooting for.
The only way it could be an eSport is if people made it an eSport themselves. Blizzard has stated they will not be adding eSport features as they do not want PvP to drive PvE development. I have a feeling we will never see rankings, ladders, replays, etc.
There are just so many development hurdles in them actually balancing the game for eSports that it is not a feasible development path. Of course, that doesn't mean players couldn't make it into an eSport despite the lack of balance. I just feel it will be hard to get big tournament sponsors to support Diablo 3 PvP when money can buy wins and classes aren't balanced around PvP.
This is some great news. They are saying that that they cut the PvP to get it ready for E-Sports.
"But what future can be speculated for PvP? Since its debut, fans have been ensured that PvP would never drive PvE. While some skills would be retooled for the Arena, the game would largely foster an imbalanced system – and they were okay with that.
It seems like that will no longer be the case, however. Bowser has recently pointed out an interview with the CEO of Major League Gaming (MLG), Sundance Di Giovanni, who alludes to why PvP was delayed for Diablo III. The delay, he purports, is to make it E-Sports ready.
Skipping to 1:14:30, you can can see the conversation that takes place on the matter."-INC-Diablo PvP – an E-Sport?
jaco111:
The video you posted didn't specifically state anything about eSports-level balance at all. In fact, the most they alluded to at all was that they might be having Diablo 3 PvP at their venue. It seems perfectly understandable that Blizzard would want to showcase their new casual Arena PvP system in a public venue. It doesn't mean it'll be some perfectly balanced eSport with rankings, etc.
Honestly, unless Jay somehow had a 180* change of heart, we're going to still get the team death-match casual Arena. Nothing in this video insinuates anything else.
You know I read a post about how PvE's are jerks, and I would have to agree with it (even though I would have used a more blunt word). You all know making Diablo 3 an eSports would not affect the PvE at all. You just want to have it your way just because Jay Willson said so. That is his view not Blizzards or or the other people making Diablo. Frankly I don't think he cares any more since it won't affect PvE.
Making it an eSports won't change the storyline and WILL NOT change how fun it is to kill monster. True fact don't try to deny it. They have the skill and as for the money they can spend it because making it an eSport would bring them more money. Money which they would use towards your "PvE". That way there income doesn't have to rely on the RMAH so much. It will also keep the game running for years.
You think you know what's best for Diablo but you don't in fact your killing it. A great game can have both PvE and PvP and supporting them both will make the game flourish. And for the last time if you don't like PvP DON'T play it. It is as simple as that.
E-Sports is going to happen, you know it, I know it and everyone is talking about it.
You know I read a post about how PvE's are jerks, and I would have to agree with it (even though I would have used a more blunt word). You all know making Diablo 3 an eSports would not affect the PvE at all. You just want to have it your way just because Jay Willson said so. That is his view not Blizzards or or the other people making Diablo. Frankly I don't think he cares any more since it won't affect PvE.
Making it an eSports won't change the storyline and WILL NOT change how fun it is to kill monster. True fact don't try to deny it. They have the skill and as for the money they can spend it because making it an eSport would bring them more money. Money which they would use towards your "PvE". That way there income doesn't have to rely on the RMAH so much. It will also keep the game running for years.
You think you know what's best for Diablo but you don't in fact your killing it. A great game can have both PvE and PvP and supporting them both will make the game flourish. And for the last time if you don't like PvP DON'T play it. It is as simple as that.
E-Sports is going to happen, you know it, I know it and everyone is talking about it.
Have you even bothered to read my posts AT ALL? Seriously, you obviously do not understand the dynamics behind game design. There are a finite amount of resources dedicated to Diablo 3 development. Those resources have to be split between development of PvP and development of PvM. This means that any focus on PvP means focus taken away from PvM...its very easy to see why PvP hurts PvM.
In order to effectively make the game an eSport, they need to balance the game around PvP. This means a revision of abilities specifically for PvP. This takes TIME and RESOURCES away from them developing additional PvM content. It also could end up causing balance changes to PvM that ruin the experience (as was the case in WoW, when they stopped making cool chance on hit items). These are a few of the reasons why those that favor PvM do now want PvP to be a focus.
Also, as others have stated...the eSport PvP crowd is a minority. There were many polls done that make this very evident. Blizzard catering to such a minority over investing its resources in PvP when its community would prefer them invested in PvM doesn't even make sense.
All in all, eSports may happen for Diablo 3...but it won't be because Blizzard officially endorses it. It'll be because players just don't mind the slight imbalance that the casual Arena system has.
I read every single post, I have them forwarded to my phone.
First off the game is already FINISHED and all they have left to work on is the PvP. So they have all the time they need.
Second if they have to spelt the recourses between PvP and PvM then they would use there half to work on eSports. Which would only be fare.
Third everyone knows that PvP brings longevity to games. Player vs computer is predictable and player vs player is unpredictable.
Forth, as for resources eSports would bring in a huge amount.
Fifth who besides you PvE'ers doesn't support the minorities? I know our government does.
Sixth you just admitted it could happen which means you know the truth and you Are just scared or being an asswhole.
I think you don't know anything at all. You keep saying the same thing over and over and it is all assumptions and guessing. Everything i have stated is facts. I also think you don't have your own opinion and just follow the crowd.
I'm not going to stop, I going to keep it going, I will spear-head the movement if I have too. I am going to post some more PvP threads and go to the guild forums and start a PvP clan to get ready.
I read every single post, I have them forwarded to my phone.
First off the game is already FINISHED and all they have left to work on is the PvP. So they have all the time they need.
Second if they have to spelt the recourses between PvP and PvM then they would use there half to work on eSports. Which would only be fare.
Third everyone knows that PvP brings longevity to games. Player vs computer is predictable and player vs player is unpredictable.
Forth, as for resources eSports would bring in a huge amount.
Fifth who besides you PvE'ers doesn't support the minorities? I know our government does.
Sixth you just admitted it could happen which means you know the truth and you Are just scared or being an asswhole.
I think you don't know anything at all. You keep saying the same thing over and over and it is all assumptions and guessing. Everything i have stated is facts. I also think you don't have your own opinion and just follow the crowd.
I'm not going to stop, I going to keep it going, I will spear-head the movement if I have too. I am going to post some more PvP threads and go to the guild forums and start a PvP clan to get ready.
First: The game isn't quite finished yet. They are still making changes to PvM with each beta patch. After release, they have the regular monthly PvM content that they talked about doing, as well as working on the expansion....so no, they cannot realistically devote all resources to PvP.
Second: Considering the majority of players want them to focus on PvM content, devoting the majority of their resources on making Diablo 3 an eSport would be a bad business move. As for 'fare' (I assume you mean fair), how is it fair to push your personal wishes for eSport PvP on a game that has never had PvP as its focus? Fair, would be to accept that Blizzard wants the game to be primarily about PvM and either be happy with that or don't play it.
Third: PvP tends to drive out casual players, actually. The attitudes of the players that focus on PvP tend to create an environment that more casual players don't want to be part of. Many people that enjoy playing PvM...enjoy PvM because of what it is. They don't care if its predictable, as they just enjoy smashing monsters and getting loot.
Forth: eSports won't bring a huge amount of money to Blizzard. Its already been mentioned that eSport PvP would likely use pre-made characters to eliminate gear as a deciding factor (to eliminate buying wins). This means that such matches would not promote more RMAH sales, or GAH sales beyond initially equiping the pre-made characters.
Fifth: Its not about 'supporting minorities'. Blizzard is supporting PvP'ers by offering to add an Arena PvP system with full matchmaking into a game that is primarily about PvM. How is that not support? What they have said they won't do is sacrifice PvM for PvP. This means that if a balance decision would affect PvM in a negative way, they won't do it...even if its OP in PvP.
Sixth: Sure, anything can happen. Of course everything that Blizzard has told us says it won't. As for being scared, why would I be? I have already stated that I'll likely take part in PvP. Why resort to insults?...It makes you look more scared and frustrated then I am.
You might not think I know anything, but everything I've said has been backed up by others...including Blizzard. I am not against PvP....and I've said this multiple times now. What I am trying to do is explain why Blizzard made the decisions they did and why they are good decisions. You haven't stated facts, you've stated opinions. The statements that I have made have been based on facts that were stated by Blizzard staff. I'm not making things up, or purely pulling opinions out of thin air.
You can keep posting, and I'll keep explaining why Blizzard made their decisions.
I dont understand this thread it is absolutely pointless. Why bother argue over something that will never happen?
You wan't diablo 3 to be an eSports? so what, you didn't create the diablo franchise nor are you on the diablo 3 development team. And when they say it will NOT be an eSports thats it, end of discussion.
.. I honestly can't understand why anyone would try and enforce the 3rd upcoming installment in one of the best franchises to date to be a eSport when the previous installments weren't.
You know your right I shouldn't have use insults like that. I guess i was just frustrated and I apologize. I dont think any one here is a blizzard employee either and if you are why don't you tell us and give us some inside information on it if you can. Origanaly this post was about if eSports was going to be fun or not. I will keep posting if you want me to as long as we all get something out of it. Bottom line is that I feel that I can get what I want and you can get what you want.
You cannot get what you want without stepping on what I want. Ladders, ranking, etc..all end up creating a sense of entitlement in players and they DO put down those with lesser ranking. In addition, those features require development resources. This means that PvM features end up getting less development, pushing the focus away from PvM.
I could see allowing players to see their own personal matchmaking raking (but not anyone else's). It wouldn't take a lot of extra development and it'd remove the ability to compare yourself to someone else and put them down because you're better. It would, however, allow you to determine how good you're doing compared to everyone in general. Does that seem like a way to get what you want and what I want without either side losing?
I don't believe they've ever said that if there are enough PvP focused players they would make it eSport viable. Quite the opposite actually, they have said they will NEVER focus the game towards eSports. People need to realize that the Diablo series is a 'single player online game that can be played with friends'. The whole goal of the game's design is focused around this design.
Casual PvP will exist in the form of Arena, but abilities and such will not be heavily balanced (think how easy it'd be to kill melee chars with jumping spiders). In order to actually balance the game around PvP, they would have to either tune abilities separate for PvP and PvE (sometimes completely altering an ability), or just tune the game completely around PvP. Neither of these are good options for anywhere in the near future as they infringe on the whole point of the game, PvE.
You may think that tuning separately would allow PvP without affecting PvE but you'd be wrong. Development resources that could be used to add additional PvE content and fixes would instead be focused on tuning every possible combination of ability to make sure it is balanced when fighting players. Its not a small feat at all. In fact, with the amount of combinations of abilities you can have in Diablo 3 with elective mode, actually maintaining eSport balance might be impossible even.
Diablo 3 is just not the game for eSport PvP. Not every game needs to be made into an eSport and I'm quite tired of people thinking they do. Diablo 3 will be an amazingly fun game that will be played for years to come, without eSport balance. If you're only looking for eSport PvP...play a different game.
No I do not want to play D3 Esports but I would gladly participate if it did. Although I love Esports... Starting in Tribes2 TWL, Counter-Strike CAL, Starcraft and SC2, it makes the games competitively strenuous yet so rewarding. I am close friends with those nerds I teamed up with and we continue to have great times of reflection of those days, but my scapegoat from that scene was Diablo. It was pure enjoyment. Casual. Put your feet up, click and have a sandvich kinda game. Thats exactly what Blizz intended
If the PvP takes over all other factions of the game, it wouldn't be DIABLO 3. Im sure many of you already stated things about balance issues, huge variables, little skill involved, blah blah, basically it won't be an Esport.. If the community invents their own support for it, it will only be that.
You might want to take a look at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_E452S_fJwA
They pretty much specifically state that they will not do ANYTHING that points the game towards an eSport. They know that people want an eSport out of Diablo 3, but they aren't going to do it. I need to ask if you've actually done any game development? Because its not like Blizzard has infinite time and resources to dump into PvP/PvE. No, the more they focus development on PvP the less time and resources they have for PvE. Having played Diablo 3 as all the classes, just in the first 13 levels you have enough choices that eSport level PvP would actually be quite hard to balance. Scale that up to level 60 and the full array of skills, runes, items, etc that you have access to, and eSport level balance would be nearly impossible (a nightmare to do at least).
So, no... what Jay has stated is not crap. The reasons he gave for the direction they are going make a whole lot of sense. Could they have made Diablo 3 a PvP focused game, sure....but they didn't. They chose to focus on their story and PvE and give PvP the back seat. The entire game was designed around this and at this point its not likely to change...ever. If you want eSport PvP look elsewhere.
If your a game developer, then tell me what is it that they can't do? What is it that the developers haven't done yet in the years they spent making this game? Tell me exactly why it would not make a good eSports. If you can't then don't presume to dictact how the game will fold out. All I am saying is that they should at least try and if it utterly fails then fine at least they tried.
Sinceraly your devoted diablo fan.
What the developers cannot do is reasonably balance the combinations of skills they way they currently exist. The shear amount of combinations would essentially require a team specifically dedicated to PvP balance and design. As for what they haven't done, I'm sure the matchmaking system isn't complete, the skills aren't designed in a PvP friendly way, the items aren't designed in a PvP friendly way, the new arena system doesn't seem to be complete as they changed the design for PvP from back at Blizzcon and likely haven't made it the focus. PvP has likely always been last on the development list for Diablo 3 and as such it just isn't even ready for casual arena PvP.
Diablo 3 'could' make a good eSport if it was designed differently. However, the game isn't designed around PvP. Many of the abilities are designed around killing groups of monsters and balanced as such. Creating separate abilities for PvP and PvE will create a void between players as many wouldn't like the alterations to their abilities.
I've also heard nothing that says we won't get PvE content during patches. What I did hear that the current shape of the game will be what we have for launch. That doesn't mean that new content (aka new quests, events, etc) won't be added during a patch.
Face the music man, Diablo 3 isn't designed for competitive PvP. Skills focused around PvE, the RMAH, casual PvP arena, and a specific statement from Jay Wilson stating they will not add any features focusing towards eSports. How can you possibly think Diablo 3 should go eSport PvP? It hasn't been designed at all that way and you want them to essentially alter everything to cater to a minor chunk of their userbase? It is just not likely to happen, at all.
First skill are limited by how many you can use at a time and by how viable they will be in the arenas which reduces the variables. Over powered skills can be adjusted inside the arenas. Skills that are good for PvP will be used in the arenas and skills good for PvE will be used to kill monsters.
Second the variables in gear does not affect it at all. People will just use the best gear for PvP for PvP and the same for PvE. You will just have to play PvE more to get better gear. They could even have set gear for PvP like WoW or the demos if they wanted too.
Third even if the matchmaking system and the arenas are not finished they will be. This has no effect whether or not it will be an eSport.
Fourth there have been other games that weren't designed PvP but turned out to be great eSports games and Diablo 3 could be one of them.
Fifth the RMAH also does not affect it. If people want to pay to get gear it affects PvP no more than it does PvE or people who want to get the gear themselves.
Everyone love PvP and will keep Diablo 3 running for a long time. Trust me I hear the music, it just means something different to me.
Honestly, what you seem to be asking for is exactly what we're getting...casual PvP. eSport PvP balance is quite a different monster then balancing crowd control and damage slightly. In order to make Diablo 3 a eSport, you'd need rankings, clans, duels, spectator mode, altered abilities for eSport (aka things like corpse spiders would need to be reworked heavily), etc. Its no simple matter, it essentially will require most of the skills, runes, items, gems, etc to be reworked with PvP in mind. It is a vast amount of development that would have to be shifted from other areas of the game.
To comment on the RMAH issue, no good tournament will likely accept Diablo 3 as an eSport if players can just buy power. Since items vastly alter your power, being able to purchase said power will heavily sway matches and make it hard to have fair tournaments. Force Gaming talked about this as well, stating that in order for Diablo 3 to really be an eSport, the auction houses need to be disabled. Since the auction house systems are the funding for further Diablo development, I don't think anyone wants that.
PvP will be in the game. Some people may attempt to make it an eSport, but Blizzard won't assist in that. Its not the direction they want to go with the game and not the direction the majority of their players want either. I will enjoy the PvP that they do offer, but don't want to see them sacrifice development on other areas of the game just to suit a minority.
The only way it could be an eSport is if people made it an eSport themselves. Blizzard has stated they will not be adding eSport features as they do not want PvP to drive PvE development. I have a feeling we will never see rankings, ladders, replays, etc.
There are just so many development hurdles in them actually balancing the game for eSports that it is not a feasible development path. Of course, that doesn't mean players couldn't make it into an eSport despite the lack of balance. I just feel it will be hard to get big tournament sponsors to support Diablo 3 PvP when money can buy wins and classes aren't balanced around PvP.
"But what future can be speculated for PvP? Since its debut, fans have been ensured that PvP would never drive PvE. While some skills would be retooled for the Arena, the game would largely foster an imbalanced system – and they were okay with that.
It seems like that will no longer be the case, however. Bowser has recently pointed out an interview with the CEO of Major League Gaming (MLG), Sundance Di Giovanni, who alludes to why PvP was delayed for Diablo III. The delay, he purports, is to make it E-Sports ready.
Skipping to 1:14:30, you can can see the conversation that takes place on the matter."-INC-Diablo PvP – an E-Sport?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=asfC56d2Awc&feature=youtube_gdata_player
The video you posted didn't specifically state anything about eSports-level balance at all. In fact, the most they alluded to at all was that they might be having Diablo 3 PvP at their venue. It seems perfectly understandable that Blizzard would want to showcase their new casual Arena PvP system in a public venue. It doesn't mean it'll be some perfectly balanced eSport with rankings, etc.
Honestly, unless Jay somehow had a 180* change of heart, we're going to still get the team death-match casual Arena. Nothing in this video insinuates anything else.
Making it an eSports won't change the storyline and WILL NOT change how fun it is to kill monster. True fact don't try to deny it. They have the skill and as for the money they can spend it because making it an eSport would bring them more money. Money which they would use towards your "PvE". That way there income doesn't have to rely on the RMAH so much. It will also keep the game running for years.
You think you know what's best for Diablo but you don't in fact your killing it. A great game can have both PvE and PvP and supporting them both will make the game flourish. And for the last time if you don't like PvP DON'T play it. It is as simple as that.
E-Sports is going to happen, you know it, I know it and everyone is talking about it.
And for the other guy eSports stand for electronic sports.
Have you even bothered to read my posts AT ALL? Seriously, you obviously do not understand the dynamics behind game design. There are a finite amount of resources dedicated to Diablo 3 development. Those resources have to be split between development of PvP and development of PvM. This means that any focus on PvP means focus taken away from PvM...its very easy to see why PvP hurts PvM.
In order to effectively make the game an eSport, they need to balance the game around PvP. This means a revision of abilities specifically for PvP. This takes TIME and RESOURCES away from them developing additional PvM content. It also could end up causing balance changes to PvM that ruin the experience (as was the case in WoW, when they stopped making cool chance on hit items). These are a few of the reasons why those that favor PvM do now want PvP to be a focus.
Also, as others have stated...the eSport PvP crowd is a minority. There were many polls done that make this very evident. Blizzard catering to such a minority over investing its resources in PvP when its community would prefer them invested in PvM doesn't even make sense.
All in all, eSports may happen for Diablo 3...but it won't be because Blizzard officially endorses it. It'll be because players just don't mind the slight imbalance that the casual Arena system has.
First off the game is already FINISHED and all they have left to work on is the PvP. So they have all the time they need.
Second if they have to spelt the recourses between PvP and PvM then they would use there half to work on eSports. Which would only be fare.
Third everyone knows that PvP brings longevity to games. Player vs computer is predictable and player vs player is unpredictable.
Forth, as for resources eSports would bring in a huge amount.
Fifth who besides you PvE'ers doesn't support the minorities? I know our government does.
Sixth you just admitted it could happen which means you know the truth and you Are just scared or being an asswhole.
I think you don't know anything at all. You keep saying the same thing over and over and it is all assumptions and guessing. Everything i have stated is facts. I also think you don't have your own opinion and just follow the crowd.
I'm not going to stop, I going to keep it going, I will spear-head the movement if I have too. I am going to post some more PvP threads and go to the guild forums and start a PvP clan to get ready.
First: The game isn't quite finished yet. They are still making changes to PvM with each beta patch. After release, they have the regular monthly PvM content that they talked about doing, as well as working on the expansion....so no, they cannot realistically devote all resources to PvP.
Second: Considering the majority of players want them to focus on PvM content, devoting the majority of their resources on making Diablo 3 an eSport would be a bad business move. As for 'fare' (I assume you mean fair), how is it fair to push your personal wishes for eSport PvP on a game that has never had PvP as its focus? Fair, would be to accept that Blizzard wants the game to be primarily about PvM and either be happy with that or don't play it.
Third: PvP tends to drive out casual players, actually. The attitudes of the players that focus on PvP tend to create an environment that more casual players don't want to be part of. Many people that enjoy playing PvM...enjoy PvM because of what it is. They don't care if its predictable, as they just enjoy smashing monsters and getting loot.
Forth: eSports won't bring a huge amount of money to Blizzard. Its already been mentioned that eSport PvP would likely use pre-made characters to eliminate gear as a deciding factor (to eliminate buying wins). This means that such matches would not promote more RMAH sales, or GAH sales beyond initially equiping the pre-made characters.
Fifth: Its not about 'supporting minorities'. Blizzard is supporting PvP'ers by offering to add an Arena PvP system with full matchmaking into a game that is primarily about PvM. How is that not support? What they have said they won't do is sacrifice PvM for PvP. This means that if a balance decision would affect PvM in a negative way, they won't do it...even if its OP in PvP.
Sixth: Sure, anything can happen. Of course everything that Blizzard has told us says it won't. As for being scared, why would I be? I have already stated that I'll likely take part in PvP. Why resort to insults?...It makes you look more scared and frustrated then I am.
You might not think I know anything, but everything I've said has been backed up by others...including Blizzard. I am not against PvP....and I've said this multiple times now. What I am trying to do is explain why Blizzard made the decisions they did and why they are good decisions. You haven't stated facts, you've stated opinions. The statements that I have made have been based on facts that were stated by Blizzard staff. I'm not making things up, or purely pulling opinions out of thin air.
You can keep posting, and I'll keep explaining why Blizzard made their decisions.
You wan't diablo 3 to be an eSports? so what, you didn't create the diablo franchise nor are you on the diablo 3 development team. And when they say it will NOT be an eSports thats it, end of discussion.
.. I honestly can't understand why anyone would try and enforce the 3rd upcoming installment in one of the best franchises to date to be a eSport when the previous installments weren't.
I dont think any one here is a blizzard employee either and if you are why don't you tell us and give us some inside information on it if you can.
Origanaly this post was about if eSports was going to be fun or not.
I will keep posting if you want me to as long as we all get something out of it.
Bottom line is that I feel that I can get what I want and you can get what you want.
You cannot get what you want without stepping on what I want. Ladders, ranking, etc..all end up creating a sense of entitlement in players and they DO put down those with lesser ranking. In addition, those features require development resources. This means that PvM features end up getting less development, pushing the focus away from PvM.
I could see allowing players to see their own personal matchmaking raking (but not anyone else's). It wouldn't take a lot of extra development and it'd remove the ability to compare yourself to someone else and put them down because you're better. It would, however, allow you to determine how good you're doing compared to everyone in general. Does that seem like a way to get what you want and what I want without either side losing?