DiabloFans

I consider the "There is not a 'perfect/stellar/amazing' game because we all have different opinions" to be an easy way of avoiding the reality that there simply is not a genre defining set of ARPGs this generation. Perhaps the genre is too obscure compared to MMO's, FPS, RTS, MOBA and so on to drive the market towards that level of potential quality. Perhaps, though popular in their own right, ARPGs don't have the staying power commercially compared to so many other types of games these days that they are now relegated to an after thought in the eyes of the over all gaming public and developers.

Awesome conversation here

I just don't think we have seen the leap in quality from Diablo 2's days conceptually like we had when Half-Life came onto the scene as an evolution from Doom and Quake based fps. It shifted the perspective of what an fps could be in terms of story and action. It raised the bar significantly. With ARPGs the climb to that next summit has been far more gradual over a far longer span of time.

Actually... slow ARPG evolution.... HL3 confirmed???

Now this is a subjective opinion but from my perspective there is no singularly amazing ARPG this generation.

We have a handful of good games that do some things right and some things really poorly.

Diablo 3 - has some awesome combat and visuals. A very smooth (when the servers aren't laggy and audio assets aren't loading) game.

Path of Exile - has some amazing options for theorycrafters and end game.

Torchlight 2 - is smooth and user friendly while allowing for a great mod community.

There are a few up and coming ARPGs (Grim Dawn, Van Helsing, Marvel Heroes) but they tend to fall somewhere in between these three prominent game's framework.

In the end, despite some clear strengths they either water down systems too much or stick too closely to the old systems of Diablo 2 where the challenges were derived from poorly worked systems (potion spamming + infinite TP, poorly worked skill trees) rather than being creatively difficult.

Also, we still have the same approach to leveling via playing through the game 3-4 times normal,nightmare, hell) before you reach end game (if it's even present). After all these years that's the most creative way to level? I don;t hate it, but I am astounded how the genre hasn't really evolved since Diablo 2 (to any great margin).



I don't want to instigate a flame war. I just don't see much else to talk about right now since Diablo 3 is in a major developmental limbo as far as I can tell.


EDIT:

I think a good follow up question would be: Where do you see the genre going into the future? What systems would you like to see evolve, added or removed, become more dynamic, etc.

I have to say that of all their IPs an ARPG should have been the easiest to get right. Essentially you need a game with good combat and rewarding loot systems that drives continued hunting for better items. Hopefully pairing it with a good story and vibrant world.

They nailed combat and have created a very pretty game. However, they stumbled sooo hard with items and endgame. They know that. We know that. The problem is, I don't think they knew what they wanted to make when they were working on this game all these years. It became so painfully diluted by release that all we had left was a framework to create an awesome game upon. I know some people theorize that it was watered down for consoles, but if the game has major shortcomings on the PC it will have those same letdowns on the console even if it was tailored towards it. Console players will be just as let down, unless they do some major work for the game.

I am optimistic for the expansions and the direction of the game, but I am still dumbfounded that the game ever arrived at the state it was in at launch.

They really built the game around the idea a large majority of players wouldn't progress past normal and would have had enough to do by then and move on to other games (hopefully theirs) and then infrequently dabble in Diablo 3. It was an IP they brought in from Blizzard North and while they were proud of it, they treated it as if it was nowhere near as popular as Starcraft and Warcraft. The massive server crashing at launch proved they grossly underestimated the fan base for the Diablo series.

The philosophy of "Look, not everyone who buys these games is a long term player and we don't want them to be overwhelmed with complex choices and depth" makes no sense to me.

If it's implied that the VERY casual gamers (those who buy the game and only progress through normal) will already be buying the game, why not have made the game for those of us who were in it for the long term?

That's an issue I have with this whole mess. I really think they expected the game to be less successful than their other franchises and they way they approached and executed so much of this game speaks to that.

I just don't get why that dev team has struggled all these years and only produced a bare-bones arpg at release. They had so much to pull from and improve and they ended up with a very diluted game. Great combat and visuals and not much else. It could be amazing, but I'll just wait until the expansions to see if they sort their problems out.

They want the game to be great, but they don;t seem to agree on what that is. Even at the basic level of design.

They catered to the idea that a lot of players would get through act 4 normal and stop and it shows.

I don't know how optimal this is in terms of xp per hour but I usually do runs like this:

Start on Black Soulstone (Soulstone Chamber) Quest
WP to Archives of Zoltan Kulle (5 Stacks NV running Unknown Depths and Storm Halls)
WP to Path to Oasis (Clear Dahlgur Oasis)
WP to Ancient Path (Clear Desolate Sands)
Optional: WP to Road to Alcarnus (backtrack all the way towards Caldeum)


edit: it pasted as a dif color font and I couldn't figure out which color is default Enjoy GoldenRod

I'll be happy to see info on where we travel in D3 X 1

I'm just waiting for the Expansion CE so I can get some more goodies

Every single name seems taken. And is probably on an inactive account in another league. A game where only 6 ppl see each other at a time having such a mmo style name system is absurd.

/rant

I don't get the weird concern folks have on those forums about whether or not their post was read and taken to the game dev by the CMs. Just play the game or don't.

For me I love the idea and visuals of the Explosive Toads. I loved it in beta and sadly I can't see it replacing something like zombie bears right now. Sometimes I throw it on there for fun, but the drawbacks are obvious. I guess they serve their purpose, but I just really love the art assets and concept so it would be cool to have seen the toads serve a stronger function as a skill set.

Also, Toad of Hugeness as a pet (rather than a stationary critter) would be pretty damn sweet.


Edit:
Functional might be a better word than viable.

How would you alter the function of something might be more of an interesting discussion as viable could be simple numbers tweaking.

Yeah, time will tell

In the future, we'll be focused on preserving the core fantasy by cultivating the roots of the Diablo storyline, fine-tuning the heroes for what lays ahead, and creating new monsters and demons that will once again plant the seed of fear in your hearts.

Mmmm, yes please

Excited to see where future patches and the expansions take us.

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/blog/9773963/messages-from-hell-the-future-of-diablo-iii-6-5-2013

Congrats to Josh