Dumb luck in gear drops I can accept. That just means I'm a bit weaker than I want. Dumb luck in rune rolls means I can't play my class the way I want to. That sucks way more. It's just not the same.
I think that adding random affixes to colored runes that only appear when they're socketed into a skill is the perfect level of variation. There will still be better runes out there to look for, but in the meantime you can use the build you want to play the way you want.
If you want it to take 1,000,000 kills to get one perfect rune, that can be done without unattuned runes. Unattuned or not does not impact the rarity. Colored vs. unattuned simply means that when you do get that drop, it's useful. Just like any rare drop in Diablo is useful (whether to use, sell, trade, or give to an alt).
It's not a question of rarity, it's a question of player experience. I'm of the opinion that it just sucks more to have bad luck mean you can't play your class the way you want to play it. Character strength from gear is a different level of power than character viability from rune color.
I agree with this 110%, unattuned runes are simply a bad idea.
Just give random stats to colored runes when you place them in skills.
Lets you use the abilities you want, while giving you the ability to change builds, and still gives you something to work towards w/o it being near impossible.
If level 1-3 runes are common as dirt by the time you get into Nightmare then you have the ability to customize your skills the way you want to play them - the difference (from what Ive seen) between a 3 and 6 is not earth-shattering. Yes the 6 is better but if you want a specific function from you skill you will have it - and it will probably be about 80% of the power of someone who has that skill in level 6 rune - you're not crippled... its virtually identical in comparrison to someone with a very rare weapon over your "average" legendary.
I would expect to be using level 4/5 runes in my skills well in to farming hell - possibly even the entire time. Getting the proper level 7 rune into your skill should be roughly the equivalent of finding that ultimate legendary weapon with perfect prefixes/suffixes.
I don't see how having to use a more common level 4 rune in your skill is frustrating - customization to use the skill you want in the way you want is easily attainable - the last 3 (very incremental) levels of power though come at the same price of grinding and luck as always.
How do you know there isnt a big difference between a level 3 rune and a level 6 rune? If runepower scale accordingly to gems, for example Meteor would have 231% more weapon damage from a level 6 crimson rune than a level 3 one. As someone else said further up here, you need the best equipment to continue to harder difficulties/areas.
Since you need to random your 5 skills, some players will find their gear faster than finding the correct runes (especially with the new artisan system). Now they have a choice of continue the game with another playstyle, or stay behind and farm for the runes they so desperately need. You dont know how long thats going to take, because there is no safety net in the system to catch the really unlucky ones.
For those who want level 7 runes to be the same as legendary weapons, why not add rare and even legendary runes to please both sides.
I understand that many people want rewards for invested time in this game, and showing off those hard earned items. But cant you leave that to gear and gems? (Before expansion with even more similiar items to farm). Since even legendary have random affixes, and the highest level of gems will be very hard to get, it seems that there will be enough to keep us occupied for a very long time. Im also pro random affixes from runes, which will keep it fun to get new runes. Just dont random the skills i use.
As many others have said we still dont have any specific details on this, and i trust Blizzard to make it a fun way to develope your character, not a frustrating one.
There is a difference in what people in here want runes to be. Some people see runes as another item to farm for, equal to gear. Others see it as a way to customize their character - To find the most fun playstyle that suits them.
My only concern is feeling gimped, maybe even have to change my playstyle, because i got unlucky with the runes. Luck should not decide the way you play the game. I like farming for items that makes me better at what i do. I dont like farming runes just so i can keep playing the way i like the most, or even changing my build so i can keep farming for those runes i need. Its as much about the ride as it is about reaching the end of the game item wise.
My point is that this is something you shouldnt have to worry about. The runes are basicly replacement for the skills in D2. Not playing the way i want to there, because i was unlucky, would certainly make it less fun.
Now there are a few things that may help you get the runes you need. The AH first and foremost. But you cant know for sure how that works out until its live and well into the game. There will be runes in this game that will be much more popular than others, as certain skills were in D2. Making them very rare/terribly expensive - much harder to get than other runes.
Most people might get the runes they want and need to continue their playstyle. Some people may not be that lucky.
Didnt see a tread about all the dodge abities the monk has, and how to use them to make some good and fun builds.
Now i dont think we know for sure how the dodge stacks, but i seem to remember reading a blue post somewhere that it works like this:
Say you have 30% dodge chance from Mantra of Evasion, and also have 30% dodge chance from obsidian rune in Dashing Strike. You then get a dodge chance of 30% (from Dashing Strike) of that first 30% (from Mantra of Evasion). So together thats 39%. The next dodge chance is then added in the same way (percent of percent).
Now the problem with dodge builds is the lack of damage. Hopefully the runestones in my spirit spenders will help with that. Especially love crimson rune in Mantra of Evasion for 120% damage to nearby enemies when i dodge, hopefully with a 50% dodge chance.
Now make your own build based on Dodge and it's awesomeness.
It appears that dodge chance stacks multiplicatively. To find your total dodge chance, use this formula:
1-[(1-DodgeSourceA)(1-DodgeSourceB)(1-DodgeSourceC)...etc] = TotalDodgeChance
So your build there has:
30% from Mantra of Evasion
30% for 12 seconds from Dashing Strike
10% from Guardian's Path
1-[(1-.3)(1-.3)(1-.1)] = 55.9% dodge chance before your passive Sixth Sense kicks in.
If you had 30% crit, you'd gain another 15% dodge. That 15% would be applied against your remaining 44.1% chance to be hit, giving you a total dodge of 62.5%.
Also, you missed the dodge buff from alabaster fists of thunder for another 20%. If you replaced Deadly Reach with that, you'd end up with 70% total dodge. Not too shabby.
Thanks for the clarification. Makes it even better, even tho i dont think I'll swap out Deadly Reach since i'll need the damage.
Didnt see a tread about all the dodge abities the monk has, and how to use them to make some good and fun builds.
Now i dont think we know for sure how the dodge stacks, but i seem to remember reading a blue post somewhere that it works like this:
Say you have 30% dodge chance from Mantra of Evasion, and also have 30% dodge chance from obsidian rune in Dashing Strike. You then get a dodge chance of 30% (from Dashing Strike) of that first 30% (from Mantra of Evasion). So together thats 39%. The next dodge chance is then added in the same way (percent of percent).
Now the problem with dodge builds is the lack of damage. Hopefully the runestones in my spirit spenders will help with that. Especially love crimson rune in Mantra of Evasion for 120% damage to nearby enemies when i dodge, hopefully with a 50% dodge chance.
Now make your own build based on Dodge and it's awesomeness.
The problem with unattuned runes is that the runesystem is basicly your way to customize your character. Having them adding random effects is like the game randomizing on how you should play the game. The game decides your playstyle.
Now there are still things we dont quite know yet. How rare will these lvl 7 runes be? Will we be able to unattune them with the mystic (and how much would that cost)? Also the AH will be swarming with runes.
Still if you get unlucky (like some people will) you will have to attune the rune to a skill MANY times before you can get the wanted effect. Maybe at the same time the rune for that skill is what everyone else wants (for example Crimson Rune for Meteor), so its either not on the AH or insanely expensive (or maybe you can just buy it for real money). Basicly you are screwed. And this is just for 1 of the 6 skills in your build.
I understand that Blizzard loves randomization, but i think doing that to our playstyle is the wrong way to go.
1. It seems like poison damage, for instance, will carry over to SB. Tho not as poison damage, but included into the hit damage of SB.
If elemental damage carries over, but not on hit effect such as life steal or % chance to cast a spell (as there was in D2), it seems the strongest runestone for Magic Weapon will be Crimson for max damage or Alabaster if it will heal. Spectral Blade could also be runed Alabaster for healing or Indigo for max damage and better area of effect. Is this the direction the build is going towards?
We still dont know for certain how SB and MW interacts. I think most people using MW will be using SB aswell, and ignoring the effects of MW then seems like bad design to me ( aka MW adding burn or lifesteal, but these effects will never happen with SB). The only time MW could be better would be vs single bosses.
Hmmm... I was thinking that since you are technically doing a melee build with SB and MW, using an Obsidian rune on Energy Twister might not be the best option.
It's true you'll like using knock back from SB/MW, so why not use Wicked Wind (Alabaster). Wicked Wind would take care of mobs who didn't get knocked back since its stationary and would even help with elites. Of course it would also depend on how impressive that huge ET from Obsidian is, both in numbers and visually.
One more thing, instead of Frost Nova. What about Arcane Torrent with Obsidian to create Arcane Mines. Place the mines just right, wade in, knock them into the mines , and any still alive will need to contend with your ET's.
I'm assuming you use Arcane Torrent before wading into battle so AP should not be much of an issue.
Using arcane mines and wicked wind could be nice, but rather without the knockback then, since it would knock them out of the twister. Not saying my build is the best, but i think 5 + 1 giant twister could be pretty fun to play, with the knockbacks to support that
As some of you have said a class specializing in shields is missing. A darker themed knight using shields and something like curses/blood spells could be fitting.
The ranged class could be a mix of the amazon/druid. Using throwing weapons, poisons, snares etc. and maybe even have ONE chosen pet (bear, wolf, tiger etc) up at all times.
I'm fairly confident the ONLY affect MW gives to SB is the physical damage increase. Read the tooltips carefully.
Yes it would be most probable from the description, but we dont know how SB works with melee weapons yet (see some other thread around about that). Anyways its too bad if they dont make MW and SB work well together, as they are the only 2 skills that really shines for the melee wizard.
Why Frost Nova? If enemies are frozen in place all your knock-back effects are pointless.
Good question. My thoughts were that they get pushed back even if they are frozen, but if im wrong i guess i should swap it out for something, hmmm... Still need something reliable as frost nova to survive in the harder parts of the game. Maybe just add lower cooldown on wave of force and add another skill instead of frost nova. Tips?
Yah, it'd work if you can push frozen enemies, I can't imagine that would be the case though. I'm not sure you need Wave and the MW + Spectral Blade combo. It seems like you'd use one or the other, but together they fill exactly the same role. I dunno, this really needs testing more than anything.
Yeah ofcourse. Since the knockback from SB isnt all around you and not 100% (we dont know how well SB and MW sybergies), wave of force would be for creeps coming around you and a backup incase your knockback from SB fails. Still i think there is a possibility frozen monsters can be knocked back, but that we wont know until we try it.
Why Frost Nova? If enemies are frozen in place all your knock-back effects are pointless.
Good question. My thoughts were that they get pushed back even if they are frozen, but if im wrong i guess i should swap it out for something, hmmm... Still need something reliable as frost nova to survive in the harder parts of the game. Maybe just add lower cooldown on wave of force and add another skill instead of frost nova. Tips?
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How do you know there isnt a big difference between a level 3 rune and a level 6 rune? If runepower scale accordingly to gems, for example Meteor would have 231% more weapon damage from a level 6 crimson rune than a level 3 one. As someone else said further up here, you need the best equipment to continue to harder difficulties/areas.
Since you need to random your 5 skills, some players will find their gear faster than finding the correct runes (especially with the new artisan system). Now they have a choice of continue the game with another playstyle, or stay behind and farm for the runes they so desperately need. You dont know how long thats going to take, because there is no safety net in the system to catch the really unlucky ones.
For those who want level 7 runes to be the same as legendary weapons, why not add rare and even legendary runes to please both sides.
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There is a difference in what people in here want runes to be. Some people see runes as another item to farm for, equal to gear. Others see it as a way to customize their character - To find the most fun playstyle that suits them.
My only concern is feeling gimped, maybe even have to change my playstyle, because i got unlucky with the runes. Luck should not decide the way you play the game. I like farming for items that makes me better at what i do. I dont like farming runes just so i can keep playing the way i like the most, or even changing my build so i can keep farming for those runes i need. Its as much about the ride as it is about reaching the end of the game item wise.
My point is that this is something you shouldnt have to worry about. The runes are basicly replacement for the skills in D2. Not playing the way i want to there, because i was unlucky, would certainly make it less fun.
Now there are a few things that may help you get the runes you need. The AH first and foremost. But you cant know for sure how that works out until its live and well into the game. There will be runes in this game that will be much more popular than others, as certain skills were in D2. Making them very rare/terribly expensive - much harder to get than other runes.
Most people might get the runes they want and need to continue their playstyle. Some people may not be that lucky.
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Thanks for the clarification. Makes it even better, even tho i dont think I'll swap out Deadly Reach since i'll need the damage.
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Now i dont think we know for sure how the dodge stacks, but i seem to remember reading a blue post somewhere that it works like this:
Say you have 30% dodge chance from Mantra of Evasion, and also have 30% dodge chance from obsidian rune in Dashing Strike. You then get a dodge chance of 30% (from Dashing Strike) of that first 30% (from Mantra of Evasion). So together thats 39%. The next dodge chance is then added in the same way (percent of percent).
So here is my dodge build: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/monk#cYdXZb!ZWU!YZccZZ
Now the problem with dodge builds is the lack of damage. Hopefully the runestones in my spirit spenders will help with that. Especially love crimson rune in Mantra of Evasion for 120% damage to nearby enemies when i dodge, hopefully with a 50% dodge chance.
Now make your own build based on Dodge and it's awesomeness.
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Now there are still things we dont quite know yet. How rare will these lvl 7 runes be? Will we be able to unattune them with the mystic (and how much would that cost)? Also the AH will be swarming with runes.
Still if you get unlucky (like some people will) you will have to attune the rune to a skill MANY times before you can get the wanted effect. Maybe at the same time the rune for that skill is what everyone else wants (for example Crimson Rune for Meteor), so its either not on the AH or insanely expensive (or maybe you can just buy it for real money). Basicly you are screwed. And this is just for 1 of the 6 skills in your build.
I understand that Blizzard loves randomization, but i think doing that to our playstyle is the wrong way to go.
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We still dont know for certain how SB and MW interacts. I think most people using MW will be using SB aswell, and ignoring the effects of MW then seems like bad design to me ( aka MW adding burn or lifesteal, but these effects will never happen with SB). The only time MW could be better would be vs single bosses.
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Someone go test this out!
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Using arcane mines and wicked wind could be nice, but rather without the knockback then, since it would knock them out of the twister. Not saying my build is the best, but i think 5 + 1 giant twister could be pretty fun to play, with the knockbacks to support that
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As some of you have said a class specializing in shields is missing. A darker themed knight using shields and something like curses/blood spells could be fitting.
The ranged class could be a mix of the amazon/druid. Using throwing weapons, poisons, snares etc. and maybe even have ONE chosen pet (bear, wolf, tiger etc) up at all times.
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Yes it would be most probable from the description, but we dont know how SB works with melee weapons yet (see some other thread around about that). Anyways its too bad if they dont make MW and SB work well together, as they are the only 2 skills that really shines for the melee wizard.
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Yeah ofcourse. Since the knockback from SB isnt all around you and not 100% (we dont know how well SB and MW sybergies), wave of force would be for creeps coming around you and a backup incase your knockback from SB fails. Still i think there is a possibility frozen monsters can be knocked back, but that we wont know until we try it.
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Good question. My thoughts were that they get pushed back even if they are frozen, but if im wrong i guess i should swap it out for something, hmmm... Still need something reliable as frost nova to survive in the harder parts of the game. Maybe just add lower cooldown on wave of force and add another skill instead of frost nova. Tips?