DiabloFans

Quote from Zero(pS)

Why can't people ever perceive things as just being "changed" instead of being "nerfed" or "buffed".

It's how a lot of changes in MOBAS are perceived, and most reasonable players are just fine with that.

That's because there is a reason to change/balance things in multiplayer games (especially if there's e-sport involved). Not the case here with Diablo 3, being pretty much singleplayer game with zero competition over anything. That's why it's so frustrating.

Quote from Zero(pS)

I ed.. specially at the Leeroy Jenkins part... made me choke with my orange juice..

edit: added [joke] to the thread title... ease up the moods everyone, this is supposed to be a humorous thread (yeah captain obvious, I know, but some people didn't get it, so)...

Thanks. Sorry, for not adding it myself - thought it would be obvious once people start reading.

Thought I'd share this with you.

Here's the source: http://www.gamefront...rom-the-future/

July 10

• In order to eliminate all quest turn-in exploits, the rewards for completing quests have been removed
• In an effort to reduce resplendent chest farming, resplendent chests will no longer spawn
• In order to bring their powers in line with each other, the Critical Hit Chance, Critical Hit Damage, and Increased Attack Speed affixes have been combined into a single affix: Lethality
• Champions, Elites, and Uniques will now dynamically move 75% faster than the player
• In order to balance the affix with life leech, life-on-hit items will now return 95% less health in Inferno
• In order to rollback the achievements players received via bugs and exploits, all achievements have been reset. This should also encourage former players to replay the game in its entirety.
• Enrage timers will now be named Awesome timers to promote a more positive message about them
• Radius of Desecrator, Molten, and Plagued effects have been doubled. Because **** you, that’s why.
• Followers will now preferentially target Treasure Goblins over other on-screen monsters
• In order to combat botting, breaking more than three objects in a 30-second period will disconnect you from Battle.net for 10 minutes and report you to the RIAA, because you’re probably a music thief, too

July 17

• In order to combat auction house bots, the gold auction house is being taken offline until patch 1.1
• In order to reduce server load after maintenance, players who attempt to log in more than twice in five minutes will be IP banned for 30 minutes and blocked from complaining posting on the forums
• In Inferno difficulty, the Warden will also gain the Vortex, Teleport, Arcane Enchanted, Extra Health, Fast, Frozen, Knockback, Missile Dampening, Mortar, Nightmarish, Plagued, Vampiric, and Waller affixes, in addition to Jailer, Fast, Desecrator, and Molten
• To address complaints regarding swapping to Magic Find gear before delivering a killing blow, items can no longer spawn with the Magic Find affix. This should encourage vigilante moderation in the forums and discourage players from complaining about anything else.
• Monsters will no longer target followers, ever
• To encourage cooperative play, all games will now be public games. You will also always be matched with a player who is either AFK, under-geared, or Leeroy Jenkins.
• Fixed a bug that allowed for near 24/7 server uptime. Servers will now go down every night from 1am to 8am PDT to ensure players continue to go to work and make money to spend on the RMAH.
• Karyna, the spider cave woman, now walks 75% slower
• Fixed a bug that allowed players to trade in-game. All trades must now take place through the auction house, as intended.
• Pots of ashes in Act I and vases in Act IV will now exclusively drop dozens of white items
• Maximum chat message length has been increased to accommodate gold spammers

July 24

• Error message number codes will now be randomized, and an achievement has been added for finding all number codes: “To Err Is Human”
• Tyrael no longer deals damage. He now follows behind you, shouting “JUSTICE.”
• In order to compensate for the guaranteed rare drops on bosses when players have sufficient stacks of Nephalem Valor, all rare items now have a 95% chance of being unusable by your class
• Fixed a bug in which player input was immediately and reliably recognized and executed. Inputs are now delayed by 2 seconds and ignored 50% of the time, as intended.
• Zoltan Kulle now laughs 75% more often
• Added in-game lore description of position desync bug (aka “rubberbanding”). This has been explained to be a consequence of Tyrael destroying the Worldstone in Diablo II.
• Fixed a bug that allowed players to have other games installed on their hard drives
• The Templar is now 65% more glorious
• Fixed several gold and leveling exploits. Players can no longer earn gold or XP.
• Kiting was an unintended game mechanic. Players will now be unable to move for 1 second after attacking.
• Soul Rippers and Soul Lashers no longer move faster than other creatures. Instead, they instantly blink to players from up to three screens away. This effect has no cooldown.
• $25 will automatically be deducted from your Battle.net balance if you don’t use the RMAH for a week. If your Battle.net balance is empty, your account password will be given to gold thieves.

Enjoy.

Quote from Findulidas

Pretty fucking hard. Especially when there are many people out there with completely unrealistic views on d2. When people expect the game to have modern graphics, modern things like auctionhouse while some people hate all of this and both sides expected the game to be the game of the century from release. Completely devoid of bugs and balanced from the start to end.

Facing unrealistic expectations makes it pretty fucking hard to say the least.

Yet many companies manage it. The trick is not to bite more than you can chew.

Quote from ruksak

I see plenty of improvement.

No longer have to remake to adjust a chars build. 3rd party item sites and gold sellers have to compete with a safe and secure alternative. Dupes and hacks have been put in check. Insanely improved graphics and sound. IMO the new skill system beats the pants off of the old skill tree, where you had to place points into non-factor skills just to get to the skills you wanted to use.

As to the vocal minority; People that love the game aren't making 12 threads an hour to show their love for it....why would we? Just to get trolled by IMPATIENT, self-entitled, cynical brats?

This game is fun...if people would stop romanticizing over an antiquated game (D2) that took many years to get to where it was, only to circle the drain because it was a financial sinkhole for Blizzard. The RMAH provides them with exponential reasoning to continue to provide a quality game for us for years to come.

All the lack of patience comes from Long wait + When it's ready™= Obviously not ready. Does this game look like it's ready to you? They nerf, nerf, buff, nerf. They fix one thing and break the other. They change something only to say the next day that they don't like it and will look into it. I can't help myself sometimes but imagine a bunch of people standing around silently and looking into it. Looking into the vases that droop no gold for example. They keep throwing "our current philosophy" at people implying that they had it different and will most likely change it again. They're acting like a randomly running headless chicken.

D2 a financial sinkhole? oh my god lol
Post-release support is not a financial sinkhole - it's an investment in the future. And they were VERY successful with that investment, hence the crazy sales of D3 (and as a side effect - all the flame wars).

About the improvements - you named only one actual gameplay improvement (not counting the reinvention of dynamic respec) the skill system. I fail to see how placing points into non-factor skills is any different than having useless skills in the pool. But ok, maybe it's a question of balance and we will be running with Hot Pursuit instead of Sharpshooter in the future. Whatever.

Yet in whole the game is "less of everything" - less itemization (less gems, no runes, no Jewels, no charms), less drops (are there even any other colors besides white blue and yellow in this game?), less gameplay mechanics (no chest traps, less damage types on player part, no Horadric cube, less sockets). I realize that some of the things I mentioned are arguably needed to jump into the sequel. The thing is, they stripped the game of everything it had and didn't give anything in return. And no, it's not the question of time or potential right now - thanks to the RMAH they will keep the game simple ant sterile.

It's not romanticizing the antiquated game. It's romanticizing an old and developed genre which was not about bufs/nerfs or RMAHs or online onlys or whatever. It was about finding loot, bashing monsters and feeling awesome. They were not afraid to throw a lot of customization options at players and let people loose. And it was fun.

And about the vocal minority. Neither do all the people, who have concerns, post in the forums (I have 0 post on official forums for example). As for "People that love the game aren't making 12 threads an hour" and the "self-entitled, cynical brats" part in particular - it's funny to hear that from you, as you appear in almost every thread here bashing and calling names at people who dare dislike something about D3.

The story is fine overall if you sum it up. It's the way they present it like the OP mentions - all the taunting and childish mocking - this is what is messed up.

P.S. "My people have been lost. Scattered to the winds. But I will survive, as long as YOU buy something" - Am I the only one wishing this guy follows his people in a most brutal and gory way after listening to this a thousand times?

Quote from lorien1973

No one ever said viable. They said combinations. They went out of their way to say there'd be clunker builds.

Jay Wilson: "So why? Why Viable over optimal? Why are we even talking about this? So, Diablo has tons and tons of customization, we did the math on the new skill systems with the combination of passives and runes and we threw a crazy number out, uh, a few years back like 69 Billion, we're really more in the area of 2.8 Trillion- Trillion? Trillion. [2.8] Trillion builds. So that's a lot of builds. Um, and why? Why so many builds? Because customization is self expression, and if you have to build a character to be perfectly optimized, that's not really going to allow you to customize that character.

So our job is to make sure that, yeah, that, you know, while there might be some best builds there's tons and tons of viable ones. It's totally okay for there to be best builds, it's totally okay for someone to go 'you know what, I made this Barbarian and he's got like 0.5% more damage than any other build you can possibly make.' And you know what, there's nothing wrong with that...unless you can't...unless that number becomes 'oh this, this Barbarian's like 50% more powerful.'

So if we can get enough builds into that range of 'these are all viable, they can play at the max level.' It means you can play the character you want to play at max level and not be beholding anyone. So what we say is, go out, have fun, be free and make the Diablo character you want to make."

Quote from Designation15

People are prone to bitch. It's human nature.

Apparently some people are ok about everything life throws at them. "Product's not working? - It's fine, really. Promises not being held? - who cares? Silly DRM? - Well, whatever. Greedy corporates? - I'm fine with that. Shitty government? It's ok - no need to bitch."
It's that kind of cattle mentality that slows things from becoming better.

To the OP it's not that people are ungrateful or that nobody understands the problem of maintaining servers. It's just that people want the game to work and the game should have had offline mode, to start with, which could negate most of the problems we're facing right now.

grats on the lucky drops, but in all honesty... we should be seeing a shit load more legendaries and sets... Remember legendary is the new name for uniques so they aren't meant to be so bloody rare that you find shit all of them... They also need to be powerful if they are to be of legendary status.

Don't get me started on how crap the items are in D3 atm. All the rage is about the items sucking so bad with nothing to find bar stupid rares since the sets and legendaries have crappy stats(most). You should not be playing for 320 hours to find 1 or 2 fucking set pieces in a diablo game PERIOD...

Go play a game of Diablo 2 classic or LOD play through to act 5 hell and tell me how many uniques and sets you find now compare that to Diablo 3... You see where everyone is coming from? Don't say you can't compare a 10yr old game to a new release, this should have been done a long long time ago. When you release a sequel it is generally a lot better than the predecessor.

I'm gonna stop here cause man it just isn't a diablo game atm...

/sarcasm
It seems like a ton of people wish D3 was a D2 clone, because "it was better".
This brings me to a couple of comments...
-I remember Arctic gear dropping from hell Baal, and 99% of rares in the game being junk..
-I remember having to carry around a tome of tps and id scrolls(or talk to cain) to identify these crappy items just to find out that they are only valuable as ground decorations or gold... which had only 2 purposes in the game...(repairs and resurrecting mercs)
-I remember the only story for D2 (other than the cut-scenes), occurred if you manually listened to each npc, during which you could do NOTHING.
-I remember only a handful of viable end-game builds
-I remember having to farm for HR's which were rare as !@#% just to trade for gear that made your cookie-cutter build efficient.
-I remember much less dynamic combat.
-etc..
How can people say that this game sucks in comparison?

-Because Arctic gear was good for something. It had something that most gear pieces of that level didn't have, so if you happened to want to use it to an easy legit play through, it was available to you. Sure what the boss dropped was junk for you, but it wasn't always junk to everybody else.

-So now you don't have to carry around tomes of tp/id but in a regular run in Diablo 3 you most likely aresalvaging or selling over 100 pieces of loot just to keep up with repairs and make a tiny bit of side gold, which in this current economy is completely useless seeing as the most you'll come out with is 60-100K. What's different here?

-This is personal preference, but I enjoyed the story of Diablo 2 a lot more. Sure it was less convenient to listen, but at least it wasn't chocked full of predictable cliche's which makes the convenience of D3's story telling a lot less impressive.

-You remember wrong. The pally alone had Hammerdin, Auradin, FoHer, Smiter, Zealer, and charger, all playing much different then the rest. The amount of viable builds a paladin could go alone not to mention the less-viable but still workable builds almost surpasses the TOTAL amount of viable (very unique) builds that Diablo 3 players have options to. (And I'm not talking about changing Arcane Orb for Blizzard and calling it a new spec either).

I'll take time on this one since I really want to remind players how much variety D2 really had. I've already listed off the major Pally builds.. so.

Sorc: Blizzard Sorc, Meteorb Sorc, Chain Lightning Sorc, Fireorb sorc, Enchantress.

Druid: Wind druid, Arma druid, rabies werewolf, fireclaw werebear, fury werewolf.

Assassin: Monks, Kicksins, WWsins, Trappers

Barb: Bard, Thrower, WW, Frenzy, conc, zerkers.

Zons: Bowazons, Javazons, Jabazons

so by my count you've got over 29 different builds that play completely different from each other and that's just from memory... Now I don't know how big your 'handfuls' are but I'm fairly sure there are only about a 'handful' (9 at best) viable builds in D3.

-Atleast the high runes were there and not there in mass. Apart from duping, if you got something as rare as jah, or bur, or god forbid you even got a ZOD or a Vex you felt GOOD. you KNEW you just struck gold but at the same time it could only net you 2 maybe 3 top tier items that didn't use those runes as runewords. You didn't find a 1900 DPS 2 hander just to sell it for 200 million gold just to look at the pretty numbers.

- Combat may have been less dynamic but the focus of Diablo 2 was on how you built your characters and what they could do. In Diablo 3 all you have is the dynamic combat and it stops there. The items are boring and generic ( Main stat, vit, resist all, IAS, CRIT, crit dmg on EVERY SINGLE ITEM YOU COULD GET IT ON), and the character development stops at the skill system.

To put it into perspective, lets look at shields. In Diablo 3, if you're going to use a shield it's going to be stormshield.. and that's about it - if you're using much else it's pretty subpar and there are thousands of shields similar to compare. In Diablo 2, Stormshield was a staple piece of gear for those in melee, the DR it provided was unparallelled with any other shield, but apart from its small bonuses and fast block rates that's all it was good for. Depending on your spec, you didn't always WANT Stormshield. You wanted HoZ, Spirit runeword, or lidless eye, exile, a specific rare shield or a few others.

To someone who is a veteran to the ARPG genre you could introduce them to Diablo 3 and I can confidently say that in less than 100 hours you could fully understand the scope of the game. you could understand what affixes you want on every character you play, you could understand the play style of every single build in the game and what items you want. Put that same player in Diablo 2 and I can guarantee that in the same 100 hours they could maybe learn 2 builds and what items to get on those builds to optimize them. I can almost guarantee that most players who play Diablo 3 or browse the forums couldn't even name me one D2 build gearset in completion without looking it up.

That is what makes Diablo 2.. SO much better.

To throw it out there, all you people who disagree with this statement keep saying "7mill+ and only 50k are here" yada yada yada.

What is to say that this SAMPLE isn't indicative of the population as a whole. Isn't that why they do polls?

Polls and surveys naturally have smaller pools. Understanding the size of the pool and the bias helps to determine the legitimacy or potential legitimacy of the poll/survey.

Sure, is it likely that 24% of ALL users who own the game would vote to like 1.03? Probably not.

BUT, are an equal number of users as far into the game as the majority of posters on Diablofans? Again, probably not.

Take it for what it's worth, and that should be that "one poll shows that a number of active users do not like what patch 1.03 did".

Good grief.

I've posted this in many threads on several different websites that has been met with general agreement. I'd love to hear some thoughts against this if anyone can bring up some valid points. Anyways, here we go!

That aside....my theory on why is there so much hate? It's because diablo 3 has gone the madden approach. What's the madden approach you ask? It's the removal of systems from previous years in order to use them as a selling point later on.

Here's some examples:
Mystic = Cut
Socketing = Cut
Death animations = Cut
Imbue = Cut
Quest rewards = only gold/exp...really? after all this time, that's all they could think of?
Item affixes(cant be frozen? cast on hit etc = Cut
Legendary Items = mostly terrible (yes I know patch is coming for buff but I don't see how they could have missed that in testing)
Skulls/diamonds/saphires = Cut
Charms/Jewels/Runes = Cut
Monster variation in areas, similar to patch 1.10 and on = Cut
Many skills seem untested (my opinion)
Dueling = Cut (yes I know arena, possibly team only...is a few months away)
Only 10 character slots, you can't even have more than 1 of each class if you want to play all of them on HC/SC
Not enough stash space to fit sets/uniques/leveling gear etc...
Blizz talks about how tons of builds would be viable and then if you play hardcore or don't want to die 1000x times on SC, you get pigeon holed
Terrible mfing/crafting

The sad part is that there is many more items that could be added to that list which is where alot of the hate/disappointment comes from. D3 did improve on some areas and by itself, is still entertaining for a while. The fact still remains that it's a stepback in many ways from D2 and it's frustrating to hear the, "wait till they add expansions/patches, it took d2 10 years to get where it is!". Long story short, I feel that with the years of experience they had, D3 should have been an immediate improvement in all of those areas and sadly, it is not.

Quote from baconing

I am not complaining about the above issues per se, and fully appreciate Diablo 3 is a work in progress.

This is my problem. What other game company/game is allowed to release a game that is a "work in progress". This game was in development for far too long to have this many issues and these types of issues.

I'm still playing though.

I am no longer a fan of Blizzard, since patch 1.0.3 and the rampant mistakes the patch has, over and above the "bugged" equipment stats (yeah as if that wasn't done to sway AH prices), instead of dealing with poorly timed animations causing rubberband death, laggy servers and super crappy loot drops the development team is busy banning people from the forums that disagree with the brown-nosers who are DIRECTLY insulting those of us that are frustrated. Maybe Blizzard needs a third party to come in and FIX their game for them, it's become obvious all they are concerned with is whether or not the RMAH makes $. The real reason die hard diablo fans didn't get a real diablo 3 is simple, the team that actually put it together and made it great all left when a French company took it over and changed the corporate agenda, to pure profit, no fun for you, we decide whats fun, aren't you thankful?

Quote from voidburn

Quote from Kooqu

I hate to break it to some of you, but if inferno only dropped 60+ items, everything would be worthless. Even if most of the stuff was still crap, you'd have so many more chances at good loot that loot would be devalued. Furthermore, we'd all quit the game because we'd all have amazing loot and nobody to sell it to.

Right.. 'cause we aren't playing Diablo, we're playing an elaborate gambling machine. That's the concern, isn't it? To protect the economy.

No thanks, not fun, not what I bought the game for. If in six months from now everyone who bothers playing has the best gear in the game (without farming 5 hours a day), and new players can buy it cheaply, it's just the way it's always been, especially in D2.

Who cares about your precious economy? The loot diversity should be so that every once and a while you'd come across a slight upgrade which polishes up already great stats, not a frantic search for pain relief. It sucks, and if you don't see it you're either already geared up (thank's to the brilliance of the launch issues, or blind luck in drops you sold), or you purposefully like this thing.

It's been 20 days now since I dropped something I could use, all I can do is figure out if something can be useful to another class, and try to sell it to pay for what I know I need. I'm sorry, this game doesn't deserve to be called Diablo 3.

Diablo 2 loot isn't anything like this crap, you could easily feel powerful and capable in blue gear, from there it was one hell of a journey to reach godlike status, but it sure didn't make you feel inadequate or unprepared while doing it. D3 lets you crawl in its shit, and slaps your hand if you try and reach for help.

This, simply this.

All those "face it or leave it" folks might go play Monopoly, kind of suits their needs better.

I payed for a hack and slash game, not to learn economy.

Ahahhahahahahahhahahahhaha

Okay. I'm jelly right now that you trashed that, but it was funny. Someone had to do it once for the entire internet.

I'm pretty sure this game has given us all times when we wanted to do this.

8/10

A quality troll. Follows the first rule of exploiting emotional investments well by showing real-life destruction of said emotional investment. Troll has a two-pronged hook; you win whether one rages at the outrageousness of the act, or from the value-destruction itself. Bonus points for having no words, merely three images.

I would agree with the OP since most Blizzard games have a massive player base and things don't always go smoothly for launch so people will cry foul every moment that something they don't agree with happens. However, it's hard to ignore not only the amount of negativety (all popular topics on the official forums seem to be about how bad the game is) and for how long it has been going on. The reason I say it's hard to ignore is because most of the so-called QQers/whiners/troll actually construct well-thoughtout and well-written posts that do a great job of expressing their displeasure. It's not the simple knee-jerk reaction of "this patch blows" but giving no reason as to why. I am certain that those people do not want to take the time out of their day just to post a wall-o-text for giggles. So unless you actually take the time to read these fine pieces of literature, then I wouldn't be quick to call everyone cynicial or crybabies.

Let's not forget, Blizzard put in a ninja hotfix about a week ago to limit how many games we could create/join for "server stability." It was the so-called QQers/whiners/trolls that flooded the forums with complaints that Blizzard removed it within hours. It was a no-brainer to almost everyone that they shouldn't have implemented that. It's because of these poor, mind-boggling decisions that people are so cynical. So how does one differeniate a crybaby that cries for the sake of crying and one that cries for changes they know should happen? It seems the OP has lumped both in the same boat.

I think it's great that people have differences of opinion about the game, I just tend to find that most who are not happy with it offer better constructive arguements then those who feel the game is great. Also, noone is forcing people to read those crybaby posts...if you don't agree, don't read it then. But to complain about complainers....