They changed how they scaled so they would be more competitive, I was right and it just so happened Blizzard felt the same way. You were wrong (that is plural).
They changed how they scaled so they would be more competitive, I was right and it just so happened Blizzard felt the same way. You were wrong (that is plural).
You are aware that percentage wise, in relation to each other, the spells do exactly the same amount of damage now as they did before right? The only change is that instead of having flat base numbers, the numbers are scaled off of your weapon damage.
This is sad, are you going to keep trying to do this AW ? Stop it. Hahahahaha
Nice. I'm pretty sure you realize I'm right and have no counterargument.
Let's use some math.
Assumptions:
1 spell a second for non channeled spells, channeled spells deal damage every second. (Fair right?)
1000 base damage to be modified by spells.
7 second time window (1 second for you to cast Arcane Torrent, full 6 seconds of it's effect).
I'm not even going to take into account the fact Crimson Disintegrate requires a set amount of time to reach full damage, I'll start you off at full power. (Meaning in reality your numbers will be slightly lower)
In both cases there is a single enemy and all spells hit.
Now, we both know your spells of choice, Disintegrate and Arcane Torrent combo, both with a Crimson rune.
I'm actually just going to stop there. Technically with no other spells I'm out of AP after 2 casts with one regen from Magic Missile. Of course, if I had Indigo Energy Armor and Astral Presence I've already shown that you can drop 5 meteors in 8 seconds before you run out of AP.
Anyways, my total damage over just 3 seconds ends up at 82,860.
(Damage over the full 7 seconds can be found in my thread. It's over 120k. Completely destroys Disintegrate, not even a fair fight.)
I'm doing 182% more damage than you in less than half the time.
If anything, the numbers on your combination have DRASTICALLY dropped off compared to the higher cost AP spells.
Edit:
I'm going to further my point. Energy Twister sucks huh?
Spells: Crimson Arcane Torrent and Alabaster Energy Twister (Alabaster to keep it in place, on the target, to ensure fair damage numbers)
One assumption: From beta footage Energy Twister lasts roughly 7 - 10 seconds meaning that in our 7 window time frame the FIRST Twister will still be doing damage on the 7 second mark.
Energy Twister 7 seconds:
1 - Arcane Torrent: 2,000 damage.
2 - Energy Twister: 1,848 damage.
3 - Energy Twister: 1848 * 2 = 3,696 damage
4 - Energy Twister: 1848 * 3 = 5,544 damage
5 - (AP Regen): 1848 * 3 = 5,544 damage
6 - (AP Regen): 1848 * 3 = 5,544 damage
7 - Energy Twister: 1848 * 4 = 7,392 damage
Total Damage = 31,568 damage. That's 69% of the damage of your combo. Remember we even started you off at full charge of Disintegrate ignoring the build up time. We're not even using the top end damage rune in this case, and the fact that we run out of AP in this limited testing case should show that with better regen, and more AP it will pass Disintegrate in damage.
But yes, of course, Energy Twister is clearly complete garbage and should never be used.
Save your breath Arcane. Eel is either egging you on or like we previously concluded has a huge ego that will shift all facts into his favor regardless of facts.
From his posts, its obviously he thinks that everything Blizzard has done is a direct result of his superb skills of deduction and reasoning. (** Sarcasm in case you can't tell **)
It never occurred to him that in order to have all the web page updates happen, the decision to switch a wizard from spell numbers to weapon damage was probably in the works at least several weeks before if not months. As assumed by many, the beta we are playing is quite a few builds behind what Blizzard is actually testing internally.
Arcane we already explained to him how Meteor is the highest dmg spell over and over and over and over to him. The kid is just an idiot and refuses to listen.
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"...We few, we happy few, we band of brothers; for he to-day that sheds his blood with me
shall be my brother..."
Arcane we already explained to him how Meteor is the highest dmg spell over and over and over and over to him. The kid is just an idiot and refuses to listen.
Yah this was more for my own interest (hence the massive thread I made comparing all the damage spells).
Just quit while your behind on the spells thing. RoF still does more damage over the same time period, and Disintegrate still beats it over the same time period, they both use more ap, but they use it over time... I'm tired of having to go to this thread now that I have been proven right by Blizzard's changes. Now the spells scale with the weapon held by the wizard and Arcane Orb is no longer stupid, Energy Twister well, isn't as bad. I will still be doing this build to maximize damage, RoF, Disintegrate, Frost Nova (instead of AT, till further notice) Slow time 140% damage, and energy armor with gold, and diamond skin with astral p, and ward, and whatever else I deem fit for the third slot. However now, I won't have to look at someone using arcane orb as if they are stupid, because it's damage is so good now, especially indigo (in keeping with the spell), if anyone wants real damage, they'll just use Disintegrate with obliteration or something.
Yet people keep talking about Meteor like it is the best, in that one second of damage it is high, but compared to RoF but I'm still keeping Disintegrate with RoF....
Perhaps I need to clarify... I was mocking the incorrect use of "your" as opposed to "you're," by assuming that the statement intended to refer to "your behind" as the possessive of one's butt (even though that parsing of the sentence is grammatically incorrect and would lack an "is" between "behind" and "on.")
why the eff does this thread still exist. The OP HAS to be trolling, I mean cmon. Really, you're going to have 3 beam attacks that you can only use 1 at a time, instead of say tossing a meteor then beaming for more dmg? ugh
Just quit while your behind on the spells thing. RoF still does more damage over the same time period, and Disintegrate still beats it over the same time period, they both use more ap, but they use it over time... I'm tired of having to go to this thread now that I have been proven right by Blizzard's changes. Now the spells scale with the weapon held by the wizard and Arcane Orb is no longer stupid, Energy Twister well, isn't as bad. I will still be doing this build to maximize damage, RoF, Disintegrate, Frost Nova (instead of AT, till further notice) Slow time 140% damage, and energy armor with gold, and diamond skin with astral p, and ward, and whatever else I deem fit for the third slot. However now, I won't have to look at someone using arcane orb as if they are stupid, because it's damage is so good now, especially indigo (in keeping with the spell), if anyone wants real damage, they'll just use Disintegrate with obliteration or something.
...and then you'll stand there in inferno just casting your beam, and since you can't move, those bone archers are gonna turn you to swiss mah friend.
Well if you had read any of these posts you would know I would be using diamond skin first then casting it (in a slow time bubble if necessary), and most meteor users have meteor and familiar for the damage and all damage stuff so I'll still be better off, and using Frost Nova to slow with slow time will make me still.... better off.
I can understand if people are opposed to Indigo Meteor because of its major drawbacks:
1) Close range to cast (the two videos I have seen of Meteor show it to cast right in front of you)
2) Low chance (from the video I saw) that Indigo Meteor will ever hit the same target, unless it is one of the largest model enemies that are standing still
3) Delay of the spell, so to hit with it you are probably going to get hit, unless it is the first cast right after a Frost Nova.
This all leads me to still like other long range spells, regardless of channel or not. If a Barbarian or other melee class is holding aggro, thats great, but if you are aggro'd... I'd rather start firing from further away. Just my thought on the meteor-hate debate
I can understand if people are opposed to Indigo Meteor because of its major drawbacks:
1) Close range to cast (the two videos I have seen of Meteor show it to cast right in front of you)
2) Low chance (from the video I saw) that Indigo Meteor will ever hit the same target, unless it is one of the largest model enemies that are standing still
3) Delay of the spell, so to hit with it you are probably going to get hit, unless it is the first cast right after a Frost Nova.
This all leads me to still like other long range spells, regardless of channel or not. If a Barbarian or other melee class is holding aggro, thats great, but if you are aggro'd... I'd rather start firing from further away. Just my thought on the meteor-hate debate
it's simple.... we use the slow time + frost nova...
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"...We few, we happy few, we band of brothers; for he to-day that sheds his blood with me
shall be my brother..."
I can understand if people are opposed to Indigo Meteor because of its major drawbacks:
1) Close range to cast (the two videos I have seen of Meteor show it to cast right in front of you)
2) Low chance (from the video I saw) that Indigo Meteor will ever hit the same target, unless it is one of the largest model enemies that are standing still
3) Delay of the spell, so to hit with it you are probably going to get hit, unless it is the first cast right after a Frost Nova.
This all leads me to still like other long range spells, regardless of channel or not. If a Barbarian or other melee class is holding aggro, thats great, but if you are aggro'd... I'd rather start firing from further away. Just my thought on the meteor-hate debate
it's simple.... we use the slow time + frost nova...
Or Alabaster Blizzard. Plenty of ways to ensure ideal Meteor damage. Play enough D2 sorc and dropping meteors and hitting moving targets isn't hard.
it's simple.... we use the slow time + frost nova...
Frost Nova lasts 4 seconds with a reduced 9.6 second cooldown, Slow Time lasts 10 with a reduced 24 second cooldown. If you are going to be using both buffs at the same time for max damage output, 35% slow will not protect you very long from taking hits. If you are rotating those abilities for better kiting, you start to lose damage output to survive.
Like I said, if you are in a group with someone else taking hits, meteor is going to be wonderful. As I have yet to meet anyone who can farm in a game in as long sessions as I can, I for one will not always have that availability of constant meat wall.
Also, repeating above post, this is list of pros/cons for a choice everyone can make for themselves in the game.
Or Alabaster Blizzard. Plenty of ways to ensure ideal Meteor damage. Play enough D2 sorc and dropping meteors and hitting moving targets isn't hard.
Now you are going to have to sacrifice another skill slot, aka another damage buff, for meteor to hit. All of these moves taken make what seems to be an OP build unparalleled in dps more and more comparable to easy to land and repeat lower-damage spells.
If I use storm armor I'm using ray of frost because of damage, if ice armor then the link above, it would be even easier to get them in lines while frost nova explodes from the beam.
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You are aware that percentage wise, in relation to each other, the spells do exactly the same amount of damage now as they did before right? The only change is that instead of having flat base numbers, the numbers are scaled off of your weapon damage.
Nice. I'm pretty sure you realize I'm right and have no counterargument.
Let's use some math.
Assumptions:
1 spell a second for non channeled spells, channeled spells deal damage every second. (Fair right?)
1000 base damage to be modified by spells.
7 second time window (1 second for you to cast Arcane Torrent, full 6 seconds of it's effect).
I'm not even going to take into account the fact Crimson Disintegrate requires a set amount of time to reach full damage, I'll start you off at full power. (Meaning in reality your numbers will be slightly lower)
In both cases there is a single enemy and all spells hit.
Now, we both know your spells of choice, Disintegrate and Arcane Torrent combo, both with a Crimson rune.
Your 7 seconds:
1 - Arcane Torrent: 2000 damage.
2 - Disintegrate: 7260 damage.
3 - Disintegrate: 7260 damage
4 - Disintegrate: 7260 damage
5 - Disintegrate: 7260 damage
6 - Disintegrate: 7260 damage
7 - Disintegrate: 7260 damage
Total Damage = 45,560
My spells of choice are going to be Golden Magic Missile and Indigo Meteor.
My 7 seconds:
1 - Meteor: 2920 * 14 = 40,880 damage.
2 - Magic Missile: 1100 damage.
3 - Meteor: 40,880 damage.
I'm actually just going to stop there. Technically with no other spells I'm out of AP after 2 casts with one regen from Magic Missile. Of course, if I had Indigo Energy Armor and Astral Presence I've already shown that you can drop 5 meteors in 8 seconds before you run out of AP.
Anyways, my total damage over just 3 seconds ends up at 82,860.
(Damage over the full 7 seconds can be found in my thread. It's over 120k. Completely destroys Disintegrate, not even a fair fight.)
I'm doing 182% more damage than you in less than half the time.
If anything, the numbers on your combination have DRASTICALLY dropped off compared to the higher cost AP spells.
Edit:
I'm going to further my point. Energy Twister sucks huh?
Spells: Crimson Arcane Torrent and Alabaster Energy Twister (Alabaster to keep it in place, on the target, to ensure fair damage numbers)
One assumption: From beta footage Energy Twister lasts roughly 7 - 10 seconds meaning that in our 7 window time frame the FIRST Twister will still be doing damage on the 7 second mark.
Energy Twister 7 seconds:
1 - Arcane Torrent: 2,000 damage.
2 - Energy Twister: 1,848 damage.
3 - Energy Twister: 1848 * 2 = 3,696 damage
4 - Energy Twister: 1848 * 3 = 5,544 damage
5 - (AP Regen): 1848 * 3 = 5,544 damage
6 - (AP Regen): 1848 * 3 = 5,544 damage
7 - Energy Twister: 1848 * 4 = 7,392 damage
Total Damage = 31,568 damage. That's 69% of the damage of your combo. Remember we even started you off at full charge of Disintegrate ignoring the build up time. We're not even using the top end damage rune in this case, and the fact that we run out of AP in this limited testing case should show that with better regen, and more AP it will pass Disintegrate in damage.
But yes, of course, Energy Twister is clearly complete garbage and should never be used.
That's sarcasm by the way.
From his posts, its obviously he thinks that everything Blizzard has done is a direct result of his superb skills of deduction and reasoning. (** Sarcasm in case you can't tell **)
It never occurred to him that in order to have all the web page updates happen, the decision to switch a wizard from spell numbers to weapon damage was probably in the works at least several weeks before if not months. As assumed by many, the beta we are playing is quite a few builds behind what Blizzard is actually testing internally.
for he to-day that sheds his blood with me
shall be my brother..."
Yah this was more for my own interest (hence the massive thread I made comparing all the damage spells).
I don't think anyone plans to sit on "the spells thing."
...and then you'll stand there in inferno just casting your beam, and since you can't move, those bone archers are gonna turn you to swiss mah friend.
1) Close range to cast (the two videos I have seen of Meteor show it to cast right in front of you)
2) Low chance (from the video I saw) that Indigo Meteor will ever hit the same target, unless it is one of the largest model enemies that are standing still
3) Delay of the spell, so to hit with it you are probably going to get hit, unless it is the first cast right after a Frost Nova.
This all leads me to still like other long range spells, regardless of channel or not. If a Barbarian or other melee class is holding aggro, thats great, but if you are aggro'd... I'd rather start firing from further away. Just my thought on the meteor-hate debate
it's simple.... we use the slow time + frost nova...
for he to-day that sheds his blood with me
shall be my brother..."
Or Alabaster Blizzard. Plenty of ways to ensure ideal Meteor damage. Play enough D2 sorc and dropping meteors and hitting moving targets isn't hard.
Like I said, if you are in a group with someone else taking hits, meteor is going to be wonderful. As I have yet to meet anyone who can farm in a game in as long sessions as I can, I for one will not always have that availability of constant meat wall.
Also, repeating above post, this is list of pros/cons for a choice everyone can make for themselves in the game.
Though if you really want to not have to worry about enemies ever moving, just invite my http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/wizard#QdRSZh!fYc!aaYaaZ wizard to your game =)
I'm either using Storm Armor with gold rune, or this: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/wizard#UbVSZO!efd!aaYZZb
If I use storm armor I'm using ray of frost because of damage, if ice armor then the link above, it would be even easier to get them in lines while frost nova explodes from the beam.