Yawn. They're using a bunch of wordy responses in hopes to confuse the reader's actual issues with the game. Straw man, deflection, camouflaging. Whatever. The game is flawed, it's lazy, and it's cheap. I don't die because I'm bad, I die because the game mechanics are cheap. There's no skill, there's no intense moments where I have to use a correct sequence to survive a given situation (unless you consider trap, kite, run,shoot "skill"). And now I'm just about out of hell and feel like I accomplished nothing. Why? Because when I died I just went back to the mobs and unloaded and died again and repeat. There were no tactics, nothing other than kiting and shooting and dying. Obviously you want this to be a gear check.. great. Guess what? I didn't get a single rare item in Hell for my class. I didn't get a single upgrade in hell. The harder the game got, the worse the drops got. This is a fact. Sure, involve luck, but should lucky keep me completely out of balancing my character when I'm putting more time and effort into the game? This makes no sense. But hey, I got a bunch of other classes upgrades and rares. What a coincidence, I can now use the auction house to sell these items and buy item that anther class got that would have benefited me. Why is this not shocking? Why, it's the RMAH. Obviously it hasn't been released, but that completely irrelevant considering it was meant to be released shortly after launch.
So now I've purchased my gear in the AH. Fantastic. Wait, no it isn't. It completely contradicts the ARPG genre. Instead of being rewarded for my time and effort into killing those shiny yellow and bold blue mobs with an upgrade, I receive a golden ticket to log out of the game and reward myself with a hefty burden of browsing the auction house. Oh fun. Now that I've put the effort into killing these mobs I get to put even more time into rummaging through this annoying storefront. Just fantastic.
You want tactics please play Hardcore, see how that changes wither or not you care about dying. Blacksmithing was suppose to fill in for low drop rates thru Nightmare and Hell. People seem to think it's useless, therefore it's their fault for "not wanting to waste gold" to upgrade the Blacksmith, not Blizzard's.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"The righteous shall fall before the wicked, and all of Creation shall tremble before the burning standards of Hell."
For those who TLDR: 6% of the population MAX could be on Inferno currently.
For those who are wondering how, refer to the following for statistical proof:
Allow me to put this to rest using ONLY what has been stated.
Facts:
Average # of Characters = 3
This means, total number of characters = 3 * # of Users
% of Characters in Inferno = 1.9%
Let us hypothesize there are 100 users (100% of users).
Therefore, there are 300 characters (Average 3 Characters * 100% Users)
2% (Simplifying) * 300 Characters = 6 Characters.
At most, there can be 1 Character per Account (Some people could feasibly have greater than 1 inferno character. This would decrease this %)
6 / 100 = 6% MAXIMUM USERS IN INFERNO
All of this ^ is statistically significant providing the average characters per account is accurate (Which is credible).
For conjecture, I would suspect that it is ~6% because grinding 2x Inferno level characters (60s) takes a significant amount of time barring outliers (Those able to devote lots of time) for the normal population.
For further applications, using only day 1 sales + WoW annual passes, there are AT LEAST 5,700,000 Subscribers (Source:http://www.ingame.ms...h-issues-790219). Based off expected sales trends, I would suspect this is probably higher and not lower (though some could argue that not everyone who bought the WoW Annual Pass is playing D3 techincally).
Therefore there are estimated to be AT LEAST 342,000 players (users) in Inferno (Given the population size is >5,700,000 users and that ~6% of users are in Inferno). While a large number, this is only a small part of the total player base.
Potential Biases:
Inactive Accounts - We would expect these to actually bias against # of characters in Inferno because we would expect inactive players to have only made one character.
Confirmation Bias - http://en.wikipedia....nfirmation_bias
What does it matter how many people are in Inferno anyways it's just who has unlocked it. The difficulty between Acts in Inferno is pretty vast in itself.
I wonder what the percentage of people in act 3 is or act 4.
So much arguing over statistics makes me glaze over the contents. Moving on...
I hope they reduce the number of blacksmith pages required for leveling by at least two (although I'd prefer by three) in the upcoming patch. The reduction in the amount of gems needed to upgrade to the next level, though, doesn't mean squat. You'll still need a jewelcrafting page to upgrade a gem past flawless.
I also understand where Blizzard is coming from with their philosophy regarding legendary items, but my feeling is that they took it to an extreme for Diablo III by injecting too much RNG into a legendary's stats. Certainly, a legendary should not automatically qualify as BiS but neither should it be reduced to vendor trash in most cases. That does not sound "legendary" in the slightest.
1.9% of characters have unlocked Inferno difficulty
Which means that approx. 5% of all players are in Inferno. That's several 100k players right there and is a lot more than WOW hardcore raiders at any rate. And this is 2 weeks after the release, so every day more players unlock Inferno, so I don't think the numbers even help their arguments.
This assumes that every character in Inferno represents 1 unique player. I know for a fact this is not true as I know at least two people who have unlocked Inferno on 2 characters.
For all I know they could be the only ones, but I doubt that, but that's just anecdotal evidence so it shouldn't be relied on. Regardless, people jumping immediately to 5.7% of all players are on Inferno are assuming too much. Those saying "mathematically this is the maximum possible" are providing helfpul math, don't then add a bunch of unwarranted assumptions in.
That's why I wrote approx. 5% and not 5.7%, and I don't see how that is an "unwarranted assumption".
Unless you can provide evidence for selecting approx. 5% over approx 4, 3, or 2, or 5.5. or any number between 1.9% and 5.7% you're just guessing. That's an assumption. Without the evidence to back it up it's unwarranted.
All I was trying to say is that people have to think beyond their own perspectives when dealing with stats. I see many players with multiple Inferno 60s but all that tells me is that I have a small sample size I can't make conclusions from. If I only knew players who had 0 or 1 Inferno character I would not assume that therefore the number is close to 5.7% or 5. I'd simply know that the people I see don't have more than one.
Anyways, on to the post itself. For me the most reassuring part is that they are looking into improving the Blacksmith. I genuinely find making random items fun, even against stupid odds, but even I stopped after a certain level because of the cost. I also think the numbers on different builds being used is pretty impressive, though I would love to see the number based on - skills only, then skills + runes, then skill + runes + passives. I think that information bodes well for the longevity of the game.
Mmm, I don't think taking the gems from 3 to 2 really helps, I'd much rather they reduced or eliminated the gold cost of combining them. I nearly bankrupted myself upgrading all my gems until I decided it was a waste of gold. Same really goes for Blacksmithing. We already lose gold by salvaging for mats instead of selling or AHing, the cost of crafting seems a bit much. I'm sure when everyone's rich it won't matter anymore, but the mat cost will scale with the AH prices so there's always going to be a significant cost involved. The craft price just makes the smith unduly expensive for new players.
Completely doctored stats. They take ALL chars into account for their stats. Given that probably 50-60% of all characters are mules, or under level 5, it's complete BS.
I'd estimate about 30-40% of all players are in Inferno. Probably more.
Well I completely trust your statistics over Blizzard's. How did you extract this data from their servers? Was it SQL injection:
SELECT (Biased_Personal_Opinion) AS Fact
FROM My.Anus
WHERE Supports_Personal_Agenda = 'Y'
P.S. I have a job and didn't want to take a week off to level, and I'm only up to Act I Hell as a result. Also I'm taking the scenic route and enjoying the game at my own pace, doing side achievements, etc. I imagine I'm far from the only one.
Lot's of whining in so many threads these days lol. It's just funny to see the WoW players try and defend the game when the real Diablo fans who've played for years know something is very wrong. If you happen to be a fan, and still like the game 100%, you're blind.
Cookie-cutter builds and bots leading baalruns for all eternity? Awesome game...
IKR... does anyone else get the strange feeling that most of the people complaining that it's not as good as D2 either never actually played D2 or it's been so long they've completely forgotten what it was like?
Lot's of whining in so many threads these days lol. It's just funny to see the WoW players try and defend the game when the real Diablo fans who've played for years know something is very wrong. If you happen to be a fan, and still like the game 100%, you're blind.
Played a hell of a lot of D2 (think I had 30ish toons) and I find it hard to think of a single respect in which D3 is not superior. You're welcome to your opinion but don't presume to speak for everyone.
Only thing I want to address is the legendary part. In wow I have my rogue legendary, Best in Slot.. Why? Cause its LEGENDARY. So if they aren't meant to be the best, then why give them a name that indicates they are. Deceive much?
Heh, not the best example - the Rogue legendaries are horrible, they draw even with No'Kaled for Combat. I have a pair, got them server first... only thing I really like about them are the wings
Cookie-cutter builds and bots leading baalruns for all eternity? Awesome game...
IKR... does anyone else get the strange feeling that most of the people complaining that it's not as good as D2 either never actually played D2 or it's been so long they've completely forgotten what it was like?
Lot's of whining in so many threads these days lol. It's just funny to see the WoW players try and defend the game when the real Diablo fans who've played for years know something is very wrong. If you happen to be a fan, and still like the game 100%, you're blind.
Played a hell of a lot of D2 (think I had 30ish toons) and I find it hard to think of a single respect in which D3 is not superior. You're welcome to your opinion but don't presume to speak for everyone.
Only thing I want to address is the legendary part. In wow I have my rogue legendary, Best in Slot.. Why? Cause its LEGENDARY. So if they aren't meant to be the best, then why give them a name that indicates they are. Deceive much?
Heh, not the best example - the Rogue legendaries are horrible, they draw even with No'Kaled for Combat. I have a pair, got them server first... only thing I really like about them are the wings
I guarentee I played Diablo 2 more than most people on this forum. There is no way to prove it, but I devoted a huge chunk of my life to it and this new piece of crap is far less superior. It's shinier, that's about it. It's just not Diablo anymore and it's such a shame. They can't please everyone though. I just sure wish they could of pleased me.
I guarentee I played Diablo 2 more than most people on this forum. There is no way to prove it, but I devoted a huge chunk of my life to it and this new piece of crap is far less superior. It's shinier, that's about it. It's just not Diablo anymore and it's such a shame. They can't please everyone though. I just sure wish they could of pleased me.
Personally I think it's the same as D2 only better, but you don't have to like the things I like. You don't have to go around saying everyone who likes different things than you is blind either.
And now I'm just about out of hell and feel like I accomplished nothing. Why? Because when I died I just went back to the mobs and unloaded and died again and repeat. There were no tactics, nothing other than kiting and shooting and dying.
Play on HC. There is no threat level on SC, just like there is no threat level if you quicksave every 3 seconds in an FPS. The difficulty you cry for is in the game, you just choose not to turn it on. And then whine about it.
Lookss good. Now I want 1.0.3, playing without it I'm gonna feel blind. Considering waiting until then to play my monk who's stacking resistance in Inferno right now. If I'm going to be able to play a bit more offensively, great, I don't want to waste gold on trying to gear him up right now then. Gonna level an alt I suppose, but hmm what to level.
Exactly my thoughts. I started a DH and a WD these days. I will no longer buy any items for my Inferno Barb before this patch is released and likely not play him that much until that time.
What is so hard to believe that there are a lot of people on inferno difficulty? I myself already have 2 60s in act 1/2 of Inferno. I also have many friends who also have 2 characters on inferno. There are a lot of players who are on inferno. A lot of those people restarted new characters after hitting inferno as well.
A lot of these statistics are simply that, they do not tell the real story.
heh... they don't understand that the problem with jewelcrafting is the COST to upgrade the gems? Changing the number of gems required won't do a thing. The problem is that it's cheaper to buy the gem instead of combine it because of the COST to combine the gems.
I would expect Blizzard to understand this... it's not rocket science.
Also, how could they have not intended Inferno to be so spikey damage wise unless they didn't test inferno AT ALL? Once you hit act 2 you're like huh.... I guess I'll kite every mob.
I somewhat agree with their stance on legendaries, they should potentially buff them but they also need to reduce the drop rate on them. A Windforce back during D2 1.08-1.09 required 720 MF to recieve about 1 in 44,000 chance of dropping. That much MF was no small feat to stack and was unachieveable until the expansion.
Also the 1.9% of characters figure is a little cheesed. But given that it's gaming I'm going to just use basic common sense here and say about 5% of accounts are sitting in Act 1 Inferno. WoW had it's 5%, which were people who during Classic and TBC were in the highest echelon of raiding at any given time. Given I'm a veteran Diablo player, that also means I'm older than dirt to most of you, so I have real responsibilities. If you have time to play a video game more than 3 hours a day then that's great for you, I unlocked Inferno late last week. Most of my friends of similar age are in the same boats. But I guarantee you we're not complaining at all about the game play right now, we're all working the Auction House because it makes trading so much easier. If you never traded in D2, you have absolutely NO right to complain about the state of getting gear.
It's only been 2 weeks and the game takes a while to get through - unless you are just blowing through the content and not bothering to clear the zones.
Completely doctored stats. They take ALL chars into account for their stats. Given that probably 50-60% of all characters are mules, or under level 5, it's complete BS.
I'd estimate about 30-40% of all players are in Inferno. Probably more.
Completely doctored stats. They take ALL chars into account for their stats. Given that probably 50-60% of all characters are mules, or under level 5, it's complete BS.
I'd estimate about 30-40% of all players are in Inferno. Probably more.
Didn't think about this, completely agree.
In the best case, each Inferno player has a maximum of 8 characters (assuming same game mode/server), while all Non Inferno players have only 1 character. In this case, 1.9x8% of the characters belong to a player that has unlocked Inferno, which is 15.2%. On average (3 chars per player) 5.7% have unlocked Inferno.
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You want tactics please play Hardcore, see how that changes wither or not you care about dying. Blacksmithing was suppose to fill in for low drop rates thru Nightmare and Hell. People seem to think it's useless, therefore it's their fault for "not wanting to waste gold" to upgrade the Blacksmith, not Blizzard's.
For those who are wondering how, refer to the following for statistical proof:
Allow me to put this to rest using ONLY what has been stated.
Facts:
Average # of Characters = 3
This means, total number of characters = 3 * # of Users
% of Characters in Inferno = 1.9%
Let us hypothesize there are 100 users (100% of users).
Therefore, there are 300 characters (Average 3 Characters * 100% Users)
2% (Simplifying) * 300 Characters = 6 Characters.
At most, there can be 1 Character per Account (Some people could feasibly have greater than 1 inferno character. This would decrease this %)
6 / 100 = 6% MAXIMUM USERS IN INFERNO
All of this ^ is statistically significant providing the average characters per account is accurate (Which is credible).
For conjecture, I would suspect that it is ~6% because grinding 2x Inferno level characters (60s) takes a significant amount of time barring outliers (Those able to devote lots of time) for the normal population.
For further applications, using only day 1 sales + WoW annual passes, there are AT LEAST 5,700,000 Subscribers (Source:http://www.ingame.ms...h-issues-790219). Based off expected sales trends, I would suspect this is probably higher and not lower (though some could argue that not everyone who bought the WoW Annual Pass is playing D3 techincally).
Therefore there are estimated to be AT LEAST 342,000 players (users) in Inferno (Given the population size is >5,700,000 users and that ~6% of users are in Inferno). While a large number, this is only a small part of the total player base.
Potential Biases:
Inactive Accounts - We would expect these to actually bias against # of characters in Inferno because we would expect inactive players to have only made one character.
Confirmation Bias - http://en.wikipedia....nfirmation_bias
I wonder what the percentage of people in act 3 is or act 4.
I hope they reduce the number of blacksmith pages required for leveling by at least two (although I'd prefer by three) in the upcoming patch. The reduction in the amount of gems needed to upgrade to the next level, though, doesn't mean squat. You'll still need a jewelcrafting page to upgrade a gem past flawless.
I also understand where Blizzard is coming from with their philosophy regarding legendary items, but my feeling is that they took it to an extreme for Diablo III by injecting too much RNG into a legendary's stats. Certainly, a legendary should not automatically qualify as BiS but neither should it be reduced to vendor trash in most cases. That does not sound "legendary" in the slightest.
All I was trying to say is that people have to think beyond their own perspectives when dealing with stats. I see many players with multiple Inferno 60s but all that tells me is that I have a small sample size I can't make conclusions from. If I only knew players who had 0 or 1 Inferno character I would not assume that therefore the number is close to 5.7% or 5. I'd simply know that the people I see don't have more than one.
Anyways, on to the post itself. For me the most reassuring part is that they are looking into improving the Blacksmith. I genuinely find making random items fun, even against stupid odds, but even I stopped after a certain level because of the cost. I also think the numbers on different builds being used is pretty impressive, though I would love to see the number based on - skills only, then skills + runes, then skill + runes + passives. I think that information bodes well for the longevity of the game.
He says on a site called "Diablofans".
Well I completely trust your statistics over Blizzard's. How did you extract this data from their servers? Was it SQL injection:
SELECT (Biased_Personal_Opinion) AS Fact
FROM My.Anus
WHERE Supports_Personal_Agenda = 'Y'
P.S. I have a job and didn't want to take a week off to level, and I'm only up to Act I Hell as a result. Also I'm taking the scenic route and enjoying the game at my own pace, doing side achievements, etc. I imagine I'm far from the only one.
-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8CBbeSAjVo
-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hI4peeO3yzY
LOL -http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YcJ_XT3oWtY
IKR... does anyone else get the strange feeling that most of the people complaining that it's not as good as D2 either never actually played D2 or it's been so long they've completely forgotten what it was like?
Played a hell of a lot of D2 (think I had 30ish toons) and I find it hard to think of a single respect in which D3 is not superior. You're welcome to your opinion but don't presume to speak for everyone.
Heh, not the best example - the Rogue legendaries are horrible, they draw even with No'Kaled for Combat. I have a pair, got them server first... only thing I really like about them are the wings
Not maths so much as logic really.
I guarentee I played Diablo 2 more than most people on this forum. There is no way to prove it, but I devoted a huge chunk of my life to it and this new piece of crap is far less superior. It's shinier, that's about it. It's just not Diablo anymore and it's such a shame. They can't please everyone though. I just sure wish they could of pleased me.
-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8CBbeSAjVo
-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hI4peeO3yzY
LOL -http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YcJ_XT3oWtY
Personally I think it's the same as D2 only better, but you don't have to like the things I like. You don't have to go around saying everyone who likes different things than you is blind either.
I'm so far away from Inferno I can't comment on it.
Just hope they don't nerf it, I want to try it as it is!
Play on HC. There is no threat level on SC, just like there is no threat level if you quicksave every 3 seconds in an FPS. The difficulty you cry for is in the game, you just choose not to turn it on. And then whine about it.
Exactly my thoughts. I started a DH and a WD these days. I will no longer buy any items for my Inferno Barb before this patch is released and likely not play him that much until that time.
A lot of these statistics are simply that, they do not tell the real story.
I would expect Blizzard to understand this... it's not rocket science.
Also, how could they have not intended Inferno to be so spikey damage wise unless they didn't test inferno AT ALL? Once you hit act 2 you're like huh.... I guess I'll kite every mob.
Also the 1.9% of characters figure is a little cheesed. But given that it's gaming I'm going to just use basic common sense here and say about 5% of accounts are sitting in Act 1 Inferno. WoW had it's 5%, which were people who during Classic and TBC were in the highest echelon of raiding at any given time. Given I'm a veteran Diablo player, that also means I'm older than dirt to most of you, so I have real responsibilities. If you have time to play a video game more than 3 hours a day then that's great for you, I unlocked Inferno late last week. Most of my friends of similar age are in the same boats. But I guarantee you we're not complaining at all about the game play right now, we're all working the Auction House because it makes trading so much easier. If you never traded in D2, you have absolutely NO right to complain about the state of getting gear.
It's only been 2 weeks and the game takes a while to get through - unless you are just blowing through the content and not bothering to clear the zones.
Didn't think about this, completely agree.
In the best case, each Inferno player has a maximum of 8 characters (assuming same game mode/server), while all Non Inferno players have only 1 character. In this case, 1.9x8% of the characters belong to a player that has unlocked Inferno, which is 15.2%. On average (3 chars per player) 5.7% have unlocked Inferno.