i thought the poll was if the 4 player cap was the biggest disappointment with d3 so far XD
and everyone is still forgetting this isnt a matter of opinion, especially since very few of us ( the few who got to actually play the game at blizz con) know anything about how the mechanics will work first hand, so lets just plz wait until after we actually try the game?
Its probably been said b4 but a cool idea might be to be able to select the ammount of people in a game. Maybe some sort of custom game where the game can support 6 people(outside of arena) so you can still hang out in game with more than 3 buddies.
Id also like to see difficulty based on area's/acts rather than the game in general. Although i can imagine that would be very hard, could be cool to be playing act 1 with 2 of ur mates and have another 2 in act 4 doing some end-game content and still it only be as hard as the /p3 in that act 1 area your working on.
In fact while i'm on that, maybe they should make some sort of end-game games where the player cap is increased
The only situations in D2 where having more than 4 people was useful was when you were doing runs. Even then, some people went off and did their own thing to take advantage of the bonus experience.
With more than 4 people, you don't stick together, and it's harder to make people actually work for their XP, instead of just following the lead tank.
well isnt the biggest games right now mmo's that have hundreds of players in the same game.
MMO's have a major persistent world, so putting thousands of people into the same world is very different from putting 8 people in the same room.
A better comparison would be MMO instances. The largest MMO instances I'm aware of are 40, which is a group of 8, and many people complain about those because at that point you are nothing more than a goon who follows commands of a leader. From what I've seen, the preferred groups are 5 to 10 because there's more camaraderie and you don't feel as a goon as much. Some people like doing a 40 group sometimes (don't ask me why), because it feels like a big accomplishment or something, I always felt I only accomplished shit if I did it by myself so I dunno. But from what I've seen, 40-player instances aren't exactly the peoples' choice and after WoW there's a stronger soloer and small-grouper trend.
People being attracted to the world of thousands of people is a very different matter. Diablo would require an over-world and I don't think that's necessary, although it would make trading more interesting.
I personally never found zerging interesting because the more players there are in a room the less I matter, or, if it's balanced properly, everyone just dies constantly. This is not going to be Diablo II where you can turn on the game do /players 8 and level really quickly. This is where you do /players 8, you are going to die (hopefully). And it's very difficult to find 5 competent players, let alone 8. With no extra reward? Not happening.
Even WoW's low level 5-mans are not balanced you can blitz through them with just tank and healer lol.
I would generally limit my room to 3-4-5 players if I made one anyway but the reason an 8-cap is negative in my opinion is that they would have to use skewer balancing (in the form off, multiple monster HP by 5), rather than smart balancing for each individual setting. I.E., if the 8 cap is in, the 8 cap is attempted to balance, the rest is kinda on the wayside. And if the whole difficulty of 8-player is how long you are going to hack on monsters or how long you're gonna stand and regen HP, that'd be a big disappointment.
I think that 8 is too much, did you see all those gameplay videos where there are 4 players playin together?
It's a total mess.
BUT, i think that they should let people choose if they wanna play 8 players games or 4 players games.
4 is kinda low, and feels like a downgrade from Diablo II.
You kind of just said with 4 players together it's chaotic and then said 4 is too low, either way I dont see how this is a downgrade from Diablo 2, it's a complete upgrade to the gameplay and to the capabilities Blizzard now have to make the in-depth combat 100 times better
And blizzard doesn't want to give people the option to play the game at a worse experience that just isnt awesome (8 player) when they know full-well once every has played it they will understand
Adding more players to the limit won't interfere with those players who want to play with 4 players only in any way.
But by limiting the player limit to 4 you are alienating 25% (20/80=25%, in case you haven't figured out yet) of the audience who does want to play with more than 4 people.
I think that 8 is too much, did you see all those gameplay videos where there are 4 players playin together?
It's a total mess.
BUT, i think that they should let people choose if they wanna play 8 players games or 4 players games.
4 is kinda low, and feels like a downgrade from Diablo II.
You kind of just said with 4 players together it's chaotic and then said 4 is too low, either way I dont see how this is a downgrade from Diablo 2, it's a complete upgrade to the gameplay and to the capabilities Blizzard now have to make the in-depth combat 100 times better
And blizzard doesn't want to give people the option to play the game at a worse experience that just isnt awesome (8 player) when they know full-well once every has played it they will understand
Despite what you might think, Blizzard does not know the definitive interpretation of what "awesome" game play is, otherwise they would have already created a game that every single gamer in the entire world from the age of 3-60 would play.
Rather playing with 4 people or more is a superior or inferior experience has no conclusive answer, it's an subjective opinion, which is precisely why limiting the player number to merely 4 is a poor design choice, especially since the Diablo series already has a decade long tradition of 8 player games.
Despite what you might think, Blizzard does not know the definitive interpretation of what "awesome" game play is, otherwise they would have already created a game that every single gamer in the entire world from the age of 3-60 would play.
Rather playing with 4 people or more is a superior or inferior experience has no conclusive answer, it's an subjective opinion, which is precisely why limiting the player number to merely 4 is a poor design choice, especially since the Diablo series already has a decade long tradition of 8 player games.
Well shows how much you know about Blizzard and there games, i dont think every single gamer in the world would ever play 1 game there is always going to be those people that cant afford blizzard games and play free to play games then try to convince themselves blizzard suck, if it helps them sleep at night so be it
But as said before, blizzard have the best games in the RTS, Action-RPG and MMORPG industry and the out of all the games, caters the best for all ages of gamer's
I highly doubt blizzard would have the massive amounts of success they have if they didn't have a pretty good definition on what awesome gameplay is, either way you kinda shot yourself in the foot with that bad statement
So let me get this straight? What ever I possibly say is nothing but a "subjective opinion" where as you have the liberty to keep spamming " 4 player sux 8 player is epic 1337" with absolutely no good reasons other then "I don't want to look like I have no friends", Take that sentence you said to me pertaining to the matter of 'subjective opinions' and take a good long hard look in the mirror
At the end of the day, I think all of us here would rather trust Blizzard ( who have the worlds best Action-RPG and MMORPG and RTS) with what decisions they make in every part of the game ( especially gameplay) then some guy that doesn't really seem to be that bright
At first, I did think it was a bit odd for blizz to set the player cap at 4...I mean, didn't they want at least 5 people in a game so we could watch all 5 classes in action?
But after watching the gameplay videos, I think it is pretty clear that blizz made the right choice. It is very hard to discern what each player is doing with four players. 8 players would just be wayyy to much action and spells going on, it would be impossible to play. It would be like a baal run with a blizz sorc, a ice orb sorc, and a hurricane druid all crowded around the minions :D.
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Destiny is no matter of chance, it is a matter of choice
And that only has a few quotes from before 2010. There are MULTIPLE threads on Battlenet forums where people are linking newer interviews that reaffirm their stance and reasons for doing so. We can be unhappy but it is happening for a reason.
The pie analogy doesn't really apply well either. This isn't a different pie, it's wanting more of if and being mad because the baker explained that if you ate four more slices the pie no longer tastes good because you've stuffed yourself sick.
D3 and D2 are both pies. People have been enjoying the peaches in D2 pie for over a decade, but then suddenly the baker realizes he doesn't like peaches, and decides that no one else can have peaches too simply because he doesn't like peaches and prefers cherries. And now the baker is forcing down cherries in his new pie on people who had been enjoying peaches from the old pie for a decade.
People were also enjoying the four player limit in Diablo1 before Diablo2 came out....so.....Whats the point there?
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If we could somehow make this
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What I don't like is not the 4 player cap - it's that we'll be forced into it. With the technology available today it really makes no sense to limit what the player can do in this kind of way.
You say that it's the optimum limit - then make it the default limit set upon any new game created. There SHOULD still be an option to up that limit.
I don't know how anyone could argue against this point. It's completely and utterly ridiculous how some of you guys tow the party line. Reminds me republicans..
What I don't like is not the 4 player cap - it's that we'll be forced into it. With the technology available today it really makes no sense to limit what the player can do in this kind of way.
You say that it's the optimum limit - then make it the default limit set upon any new game created. There SHOULD still be an option to up that limit.
I don't know how anyone could argue against this point. It's completely and utterly ridiculous how some of you guys tow the party line. Reminds me republicans..
Your not forced into playing with 4 players, you can play by yourself, just with 1 friend, 2 friends, or even 3 friends and the decision to make 4 players the max is nothing to do with there technology, it's to do with gameplay
Not only is it the optimum limit, Blizzard rightfully don't want to give player's the option to play there game in a way that will make the experience less enjoyable ( And it also brings other issues to the table when there is 8 player games available)
I don't know how people could continue to argue against blizzard's obvious reasoning's. It's ridiculous how the 5% of you out there tow the "Anti-Blizzard (I wanna seem cool and unique)" line....
If you honestly don't like it, keep playing Diablo 2, glhf.
What I don't like is not the 4 player cap - it's that we'll be forced into it. With the technology available today it really makes no sense to limit what the player can do in this kind of way.
You say that it's the optimum limit - then make it the default limit set upon any new game created. There SHOULD still be an option to up that limit.
I don't know how anyone could argue against this point. It's completely and utterly ridiculous how some of you guys tow the party line. Reminds me republicans..
Exactly what I have been saying for the past, ummm, 30 or so posts. However fanatical fanboys incapable of individual thoughts kept repeating the same argument of "If this is what Blizzard decided on, it MUST be the best decision, because Blizzard is God."
It isn't up to Blizzard to determine for all of us how many players is the "most optimum" fun.
Every player has their own personal preferences on how many players we want to play with, the best design choice Blizzard can do is to provide as many options as they possibly can to players so we can play the games the way we want.
I don't know how people could continue to argue against blizzard's obvious reasoning's. It's ridiculous how the 5% of you out there tow the "Anti-Blizzard (I wanna seem cool and unique)" line....
Exactly what I have been saying for the past, ummm, 30 or so posts. However fanatical fanboys incapable of individual thoughts kept repeating the same argument of "If this is what Blizzard decided on, it MUST be the best decision, because Blizzard is God."
It isn't up to Blizzard to determine for all of us how many players is the "most optimum" fun.
Every player has their own personal preferences on how many players we want to play with, the best design choice Blizzard can do is to provide as many options as they possibly can to players so we can play the games the way we want.
Lol, still being stubborn and ignoring the fact that the players agree with blizzard and it's not only Blizzard making these decision's they have feedback, you know? they're making decisions based on what they think is going to work the best and be the most enjoyable aswell as fan/player feedback
The best design choice for blizzard is indeed to provide as many options as they possibly can to player's, which in there eyes and to the majority of fans is a 4 player cap, stop droning on about how important you are in this world, it's getting quite tiring
I don't know how people could continue to argue against blizzard's obvious reasoning's. It's ridiculous how the 5% of you out there tow the "Anti-Blizzard (I wanna seem cool and unique)" line....
20/80 = 5%?
Please tell me where you learned math. It's obvious you guys do a lot of crack there.
When I first referred to the Polls the number's where 80% and 20%, I don't care what they are now, It's most probably you making 10+ accounts to spam votes in No, so for all im concerned in the big picture it's actually probably 95% to 5% if you take more then just a few people from a website
I don't know how people could continue to argue against blizzard's obvious reasoning's. It's ridiculous how the 5% of you out there tow the "Anti-Blizzard (I wanna seem cool and unique)" line....
20/80 = 5%?
Please tell me where you learned math. It's obvious you guys do a lot of crack there.
When I first referred to the Polls the number's where 80% and 20%, I don't care what they are now, It's most probably you making 10+ accounts to spam votes in No, so for all im concerned in the big picture it's actually probably 95% to 5% if you take more then just a few people from a website
douche
I haven't even thought of creating accounts and spamming votes.
If you want, I can make the poll open and you can see who exactly voted on them. Or you can just ask the moderator if a large number of new accounts have been created and voted on the poll.
I haven't even thought of creating accounts and spamming votes.
If you want, I can make the poll open and you can see who exactly voted on them. Or you can just ask the moderator if a large number of new accounts have been created and voted on the poll.
Lol, yeah you should stick to arguing about me getting IP banned and not refer back to the topic at hand, because at the end of the day your slowly beginning to realise how stupid you really are, this poll really means nothing in the larger picture, it all comes down to Blizzard being better then you at designing games
It's funny how you keep saying ""If this is what Blizzard decided on, it MUST be the best decision, because Blizzard is God." when that is about 5% of what everyone has been saying including me, again just showing how stubborn you really are and just read what you want to read, there is no point talking any further sense to you, I haven't met someone as stubborn and childish as you, just keep reading your first post, you dont want to look like a squad of losers with no friends, lmao that pretty much sums you up in one sentence....
edit: Wow, can you stop changing your post all the time? are you like 12 and need to get someone to read over what you write?
btw, My mathematics are just fine, you should learn some better interpretation skills, because I was not refering to this poll with my 5% reference, wow... so stupid..
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and everyone is still forgetting this isnt a matter of opinion, especially since very few of us ( the few who got to actually play the game at blizz con) know anything about how the mechanics will work first hand, so lets just plz wait until after we actually try the game?
see you in beta ^___^
Id also like to see difficulty based on area's/acts rather than the game in general. Although i can imagine that would be very hard, could be cool to be playing act 1 with 2 of ur mates and have another 2 in act 4 doing some end-game content and still it only be as hard as the /p3 in that act 1 area your working on.
In fact while i'm on that, maybe they should make some sort of end-game games where the player cap is increased
Thanks Caniroth for the awesome sig!
With more than 4 people, you don't stick together, and it's harder to make people actually work for their XP, instead of just following the lead tank.
A better comparison would be MMO instances. The largest MMO instances I'm aware of are 40, which is a group of 8, and many people complain about those because at that point you are nothing more than a goon who follows commands of a leader. From what I've seen, the preferred groups are 5 to 10 because there's more camaraderie and you don't feel as a goon as much. Some people like doing a 40 group sometimes (don't ask me why), because it feels like a big accomplishment or something, I always felt I only accomplished shit if I did it by myself so I dunno. But from what I've seen, 40-player instances aren't exactly the peoples' choice and after WoW there's a stronger soloer and small-grouper trend.
People being attracted to the world of thousands of people is a very different matter. Diablo would require an over-world and I don't think that's necessary, although it would make trading more interesting.
I personally never found zerging interesting because the more players there are in a room the less I matter, or, if it's balanced properly, everyone just dies constantly. This is not going to be Diablo II where you can turn on the game do /players 8 and level really quickly. This is where you do /players 8, you are going to die (hopefully). And it's very difficult to find 5 competent players, let alone 8. With no extra reward? Not happening.
Even WoW's low level 5-mans are not balanced you can blitz through them with just tank and healer lol.
I would generally limit my room to 3-4-5 players if I made one anyway but the reason an 8-cap is negative in my opinion is that they would have to use skewer balancing (in the form off, multiple monster HP by 5), rather than smart balancing for each individual setting. I.E., if the 8 cap is in, the 8 cap is attempted to balance, the rest is kinda on the wayside. And if the whole difficulty of 8-player is how long you are going to hack on monsters or how long you're gonna stand and regen HP, that'd be a big disappointment.
-Thomas Jefferson
Interesting to see how aggressive they'll be with sabotaging mods and the accounts that try them.
You kind of just said with 4 players together it's chaotic and then said 4 is too low, either way I dont see how this is a downgrade from Diablo 2, it's a complete upgrade to the gameplay and to the capabilities Blizzard now have to make the in-depth combat 100 times better
And blizzard doesn't want to give people the option to play the game at a worse experience that just isnt awesome (8 player) when they know full-well once every has played it they will understand
But by limiting the player limit to 4 you are alienating 25% (20/80=25%, in case you haven't figured out yet) of the audience who does want to play with more than 4 people.
Despite what you might think, Blizzard does not know the definitive interpretation of what "awesome" game play is, otherwise they would have already created a game that every single gamer in the entire world from the age of 3-60 would play.
Rather playing with 4 people or more is a superior or inferior experience has no conclusive answer, it's an subjective opinion, which is precisely why limiting the player number to merely 4 is a poor design choice, especially since the Diablo series already has a decade long tradition of 8 player games.
Well shows how much you know about Blizzard and there games, i dont think every single gamer in the world would ever play 1 game there is always going to be those people that cant afford blizzard games and play free to play games then try to convince themselves blizzard suck, if it helps them sleep at night so be it
But as said before, blizzard have the best games in the RTS, Action-RPG and MMORPG industry and the out of all the games, caters the best for all ages of gamer's
I highly doubt blizzard would have the massive amounts of success they have if they didn't have a pretty good definition on what awesome gameplay is, either way you kinda shot yourself in the foot with that bad statement
So let me get this straight? What ever I possibly say is nothing but a "subjective opinion" where as you have the liberty to keep spamming " 4 player sux 8 player is epic 1337" with absolutely no good reasons other then "I don't want to look like I have no friends", Take that sentence you said to me pertaining to the matter of 'subjective opinions' and take a good long hard look in the mirror
At the end of the day, I think all of us here would rather trust Blizzard ( who have the worlds best Action-RPG and MMORPG and RTS) with what decisions they make in every part of the game ( especially gameplay) then some guy that doesn't really seem to be that bright
But after watching the gameplay videos, I think it is pretty clear that blizz made the right choice. It is very hard to discern what each player is doing with four players. 8 players would just be wayyy to much action and spells going on, it would be impossible to play. It would be like a baal run with a blizz sorc, a ice orb sorc, and a hurricane druid all crowded around the minions :D.
People were also enjoying the four player limit in Diablo1 before Diablo2 came out....so.....Whats the point there?
If you want to arrange it
This world you can change it
If we could somehow make this
Christmas thing last
By helping a neighbor
Or even a stranger
And to know who needs help
You need only just ask
You say that it's the optimum limit - then make it the default limit set upon any new game created. There SHOULD still be an option to up that limit.
I don't know how anyone could argue against this point. It's completely and utterly ridiculous how some of you guys tow the party line. Reminds me republicans..
Your not forced into playing with 4 players, you can play by yourself, just with 1 friend, 2 friends, or even 3 friends and the decision to make 4 players the max is nothing to do with there technology, it's to do with gameplay
Not only is it the optimum limit, Blizzard rightfully don't want to give player's the option to play there game in a way that will make the experience less enjoyable ( And it also brings other issues to the table when there is 8 player games available)
I don't know how people could continue to argue against blizzard's obvious reasoning's. It's ridiculous how the 5% of you out there tow the "Anti-Blizzard (I wanna seem cool and unique)" line....
If you honestly don't like it, keep playing Diablo 2, glhf.
Exactly what I have been saying for the past, ummm, 30 or so posts. However fanatical fanboys incapable of individual thoughts kept repeating the same argument of "If this is what Blizzard decided on, it MUST be the best decision, because Blizzard is God."
It isn't up to Blizzard to determine for all of us how many players is the "most optimum" fun.
Every player has their own personal preferences on how many players we want to play with, the best design choice Blizzard can do is to provide as many options as they possibly can to players so we can play the games the way we want.
20/80 = 5%?
Lol, still being stubborn and ignoring the fact that the players agree with blizzard and it's not only Blizzard making these decision's they have feedback, you know? they're making decisions based on what they think is going to work the best and be the most enjoyable aswell as fan/player feedback
The best design choice for blizzard is indeed to provide as many options as they possibly can to player's, which in there eyes and to the majority of fans is a 4 player cap, stop droning on about how important you are in this world, it's getting quite tiring
When I first referred to the Polls the number's where 80% and 20%, I don't care what they are now, It's most probably you making 10+ accounts to spam votes in No, so for all im concerned in the big picture it's actually probably 95% to 5% if you take more then just a few people from a website
I haven't even thought of creating accounts and spamming votes.
If you want, I can make the poll open and you can see who exactly voted on them. Or you can just ask the moderator if a large number of new accounts have been created and voted on the poll.
Lol, yeah you should stick to arguing about me getting IP banned and not refer back to the topic at hand, because at the end of the day your slowly beginning to realise how stupid you really are, this poll really means nothing in the larger picture, it all comes down to Blizzard being better then you at designing games
It's funny how you keep saying ""If this is what Blizzard decided on, it MUST be the best decision, because Blizzard is God." when that is about 5% of what everyone has been saying including me, again just showing how stubborn you really are and just read what you want to read, there is no point talking any further sense to you, I haven't met someone as stubborn and childish as you, just keep reading your first post, you dont want to look like a squad of losers with no friends, lmao that pretty much sums you up in one sentence....
edit: Wow, can you stop changing your post all the time? are you like 12 and need to get someone to read over what you write?
btw, My mathematics are just fine, you should learn some better interpretation skills, because I was not refering to this poll with my 5% reference, wow... so stupid..