Alongside recent changes about the Demon Hunter's Hatred regeneration and how damage is calculated across all classes, Bashiok recently responded to a question about the Monk's Mantras, specifically why they need to be refreshed instead of simply toggled.
In order to give players an incentive to refresh their Mantras (which, if you didn't know, currently function almost identically to Auras), there has been talk of implementing short term bonuses to Mantras when the player first activates them.
Official Blizzard Quote:
I thought one of us had already posted on this but I'm having trouble locating it... NO MATTER!
We're toying around with making mantras more of an active ability currently. Right now it's just a really short duration buff, which isn't very cool, as stated. What we think will be cool, is that when hitting the button to cast a mantra you get a super-mega buff (or effect) for a short time, and then the buff would lower to its normal levels after.
You can see that design currently on a couple skill descriptions on the site, they're just not reflected in-game.
Keep in mind it's still all of course in testing.
This gives mantras a more 'use oriented' flavor. So while it's a short duration that's OK because you want to hit the mantra button more than once every two minutes, it becomes an active skill. So far we think it's working pretty well.
What we don't want is to have long duration buffs or toggles, because then it may as well be a passive. We want our active skills to be active, and so hopefully this change achieves that.
As with the reworking of the Demon Hunter's Hatred regeneration, the Mantra changes are up on the Monk's official skill page, but the change has not been implemented in the current build of the beta. If they were implemented, the skill descriptions would be changed to match the current ones on the Diablo III site:
Mantra of Evasion - Recite a Mantra that grants you and all allies within 40 yards a 30% chance to dodge attacks. Lasts 120 seconds. Dodge chance is doubled in the first 3 seconds.
Mantra of Healing - Recite a Mantra that causes you and all allies within 40 yards to gain increased Life regeneration by 106.4 Life per second. Lasts 120 seconds. Life regeneration is doubled in the first 3 seconds.
Mantra of Conviction - Recite a Mantra that causes all enemies within 20 yards of you to take 20% additional damage. Lasts 120 seconds. Additional damage is doubled in the first 3 seconds.
Previously the sections about the first three seconds weren't included in the skill description, and the change to the other mantra, Mantra of Retribution, is currently unknown. Each skill currently has a cooldown of 30 seconds, so this change would most likely make it advantageous to simply use the Mantra every thirty seconds.
These changes have also raised questions about the Wizard's Armors and the Barbarian's Shouts. Although the Barbarian gains fury from some of his shouts, the Wizard currently gains no bonus from refreshing her armors, and it seems as though a similar incentive could be used for both classes. If that happens, and when the Mantra change is implemented, you can be sure we'll let you know.
So what do you think about the Monk's Mantras? Should they just be passive skills? Should you just toggle them on and off? Or do these changes provide enough of an incentive to refresh the Mantra every 30 seconds? Be sure to discuss your opinion in the topic below.
Sounds great with smaller and "faster" mantras. Passive ftw.
Monk is an interesting character what I've seen.
Gonna be fun to see it in action and how runes will effect these!
I like the idea of the 30 second cool down providing it has to be actually used by the player and isn't always on. Thus far the effects of the first two mantras are sweet, however I'm not totally sure how I feel about conviction and the amount of damage increase. But given the fact that the monk is a very agile class it will give a huge bonus for combat if he has spirit up for the first few seconds of the fight. Might make sense
Could be a good idea but I don't know if doubling the effect for just 3 secs is such a great bonus...seems not something much useful.
Still, I've not even played the beta so I may be wrong about it.
I love everything about this change. Perma-buffs are boring as hell; these short-term buffs make the reapplying buffs viable, and give them purpose. If this change makes its way into the game as-is, I can't wait to see the ripple effect it will have on other classes.
I think it's certainly a step in the right direction, but of course they are going to have to make sure it's not SO good, that it replaces other skills being used. If having 40% damage instead of 20% damage is way better than some other ability the Monk will just spam the Mantra and a spirit generator and ignore other abilities, probably not the way to go. I'm sure that it will be balanced correctly eventually, but I suspect they will have some problems with that to start with.
Blizzard is definitely turning over every rock these days.
It sucks that the release has been pushed, but I'm sure this mentality will make D3 all the more better in the end.
Many, many games just accept the game mechanics of auras/mantras/armor etc. If nothing else, it's refreshing to see a developer go "hey, let's try it this way instead".
I agree totally - this careful review of everything is what is going to make such a huge difference between a "ready" release and a polished release.
It will be worth the wait, for sure, if this is the degree of detail they are going into for each class. I'm curious to see what they come up with for the Wizard armors.
Mantra of Conviction - Recite a Mantra that causes all enemies within 20 yards of you to take 20% additional damage....
Its seems to me every 4 person group would want a monk in inferno. Even if they don't do anything hardly at all, they are improving the group by almost as much as someone spamming abilities.
As for the 3 seconds every 30 seconds--sounds good, especially because skilled players can time the mantras to crucial moments.
Each skill currently has a cooldown of 30 seconds, so this change would most likely make it advantageous to simply use the Mantra every thirty seconds.
I feel that this is off. the change will make timing crucial. Why hit mantra of healing just because the cooldown is off? wait until you have something to heal I think.
Duration of the initial buff from Monk Mantras seems insignifigant to me, extending to 6 or even 9 seconds afterwards would make more sense. In addition to that, having a global cooldown for all mantras after using a mantra would fix spamming problems. I do agree that the Wizards shields, and maybe even the Barbs shouts could use some attention and revamping. For instance, instead of doubling the effect for Wizards shields, the developers could adopt a skill proc attributed to the shield upon casting, this would not effect the skill afterwards but would instead give another reason to re-cast or even go to the point of creating oppertunities of when to choose to reactivate that shield. Example, when first casting Ice Armor, the Wizzard, casts a Frost Nova; When casting Energy Armor, the Wizard, also casts an Arcane Orb. I know that some runes actually attribute certain skill procs, such as Frost Nova for the Ice Armor, but would make the skill that much more versatile.
And to be perfectly honest, why just double the effects for a short time period afterwards, that seems an obvious solution and doesnt add anything really substancial to the game.
Duration of the initial buff from Monk Mantras seems insignifigant to me, extending to 6 or even 9 seconds afterwards would make more sense. In addition to that, having a global cooldown for all mantras after using a mantra would fix spamming problems. I do agree that the Wizards shields, and maybe even the Barbs shouts could use some attention and revamping. For instance, instead of doubling the effect for Wizards shields, the developers could adopt a skill proc attributed to the shield upon casting, this would not effect the skill afterwards but would instead give another reason to re-cast or even go to the point of creating oppertunities of when to choose to reactivate that shield. Example, when first casting Ice Armor, the Wizzard, casts a Frost Nova; When casting Energy Armor, the Wizard, also casts an Arcane Orb. I know that some runes actually attribute certain skill procs, such as Frost Nova for the Ice Armor, but would make the skill that much more versatile.
And to be perfectly honest, why just double the effects for a short time period afterwards, that seems an obvious solution and doesnt add anything really substantial to the game.
Mantras don't waste skills slots. Instead it would be turn on/ off with only 1 cost: ur total spirit, so u'd use all ur skill slot with real habilities and could chose using no mantra and have 100% of ur spirit avalable OR activate any mantra avalable and lost like 50% of ur total spirit pool (this way u can use less skills)
In order to give players an incentive to refresh their Mantras (which, if you didn't know, currently function almost identically to Auras), there has been talk of implementing short term bonuses to Mantras when the player first activates them.
Official Blizzard Quote:
I thought one of us had already posted on this but I'm having trouble locating it... NO MATTER!
We're toying around with making mantras more of an active ability currently. Right now it's just a really short duration buff, which isn't very cool, as stated. What we think will be cool, is that when hitting the button to cast a mantra you get a super-mega buff (or effect) for a short time, and then the buff would lower to its normal levels after.
You can see that design currently on a couple skill descriptions on the site, they're just not reflected in-game.
Keep in mind it's still all of course in testing.
This gives mantras a more 'use oriented' flavor. So while it's a short duration that's OK because you want to hit the mantra button more than once every two minutes, it becomes an active skill. So far we think it's working pretty well.
What we don't want is to have long duration buffs or toggles, because then it may as well be a passive. We want our active skills to be active, and so hopefully this change achieves that.
Mantra of Evasion - Recite a Mantra that grants you and all allies within 40 yards a 30% chance to dodge attacks. Lasts 120 seconds. Dodge chance is doubled in the first 3 seconds.
Mantra of Healing - Recite a Mantra that causes you and all allies within 40 yards to gain increased Life regeneration by 106.4 Life per second. Lasts 120 seconds. Life regeneration is doubled in the first 3 seconds.
Mantra of Conviction - Recite a Mantra that causes all enemies within 20 yards of you to take 20% additional damage. Lasts 120 seconds. Additional damage is doubled in the first 3 seconds.
Previously the sections about the first three seconds weren't included in the skill description, and the change to the other mantra, Mantra of Retribution, is currently unknown. Each skill currently has a cooldown of 30 seconds, so this change would most likely make it advantageous to simply use the Mantra every thirty seconds.
These changes have also raised questions about the Wizard's Armors and the Barbarian's Shouts. Although the Barbarian gains fury from some of his shouts, the Wizard currently gains no bonus from refreshing her armors, and it seems as though a similar incentive could be used for both classes. If that happens, and when the Mantra change is implemented, you can be sure we'll let you know.
So what do you think about the Monk's Mantras? Should they just be passive skills? Should you just toggle them on and off? Or do these changes provide enough of an incentive to refresh the Mantra every 30 seconds? Be sure to discuss your opinion in the topic below.
Find any Diablo news? Contact me or anyone else on the news team.
DiabloFans: Facebook, Twitter, YouTube, Live Chat
Monk is an interesting character what I've seen.
Gonna be fun to see it in action and how runes will effect these!
Nice article Jackzor, as always!
:: Enkeria [Twitter / Twitch / Website / Tattoos]
Would save so much time and effort.
Still, I've not even played the beta so I may be wrong about it.
Nice post Jackzor!
http://ypslon.deviantart.com/
http://www.livestrea...m/diabloiiibeta
I agree totally - this careful review of everything is what is going to make such a huge difference between a "ready" release and a polished release.
It will be worth the wait, for sure, if this is the degree of detail they are going into for each class. I'm curious to see what they come up with for the Wizard armors.
Its seems to me every 4 person group would want a monk in inferno. Even if they don't do anything hardly at all, they are improving the group by almost as much as someone spamming abilities.
As for the 3 seconds every 30 seconds--sounds good, especially because skilled players can time the mantras to crucial moments.
I feel that this is off. the change will make timing crucial. Why hit mantra of healing just because the cooldown is off? wait until you have something to heal I think.
Exactly
And to be perfectly honest, why just double the effects for a short time period afterwards, that seems an obvious solution and doesnt add anything really substancial to the game.
Just my two cents.
And to be perfectly honest, why just double the effects for a short time period afterwards, that seems an obvious solution and doesnt add anything really substantial to the game.
Just my two cents.
Mantras don't waste skills slots. Instead it would be turn on/ off with only 1 cost: ur total spirit, so u'd use all ur skill slot with real habilities and could chose using no mantra and have 100% of ur spirit avalable OR activate any mantra avalable and lost like 50% of ur total spirit pool (this way u can use less skills)
I think its really bad idea. Make it passive and problem is solved.